RUSSELL APIARIES- FACTS, and first hand knowledge... He taught me how to raise bees

I guess some do not understand the "laws" dealing with "public record" and "freedom of information" -- so I repeat myself -- There are still those that remind me of the old quote "don't bother me with the facts, my mind is already made up".

There was nothing said by this inspector other than, (1) SippyBees and Major stated the truth, (2) I will not speak specifics on a case, and (3) that "public record" documentation was sent to Barry since he is the moderator of the thread that has been involved.

Maybe some are unfamiliar with the terms "public record" and "freedom of information" as they pertain to the individual citizens, which also includes state employees. Those that know me personally and others that have dealt with me during business know how I stand (almost on a soapbox) about government in our lives. However, they also know that certain laws are needed to protect everyone. I have the duty to regulate some of those laws and I take it seriously. This thread has started down the same road others have and that is the reason I speak up. I will, however do as I have in the past and that is not address specifics in a case, but let me be clear, once a case has gone through the court system and settled it becomes "public record" and covered under "freedom of information". in most all states.

ok.. am gonna chill for a moment and share a little history.. :) Before I started helping JN Russell... I used to go visit him. He was kind of a bragger.. was just his personality... but I appreciated it. He ALWAYS handed me this stack of envelopes and I can still hear him saying" hey.. look at this... take a look at this one... whatta ya think??" He would have a STACK of letters wanting to buy queens/ packages in November. 75% of his next years earnings were sitting on that end table before he ever even went out and TOUCHED a hive. I was always impressed... but was a long while before I actually took up beekeeping and spent those 3 years with him learning what he did. In MY opinion... it is a PRIVELEGE that queen producers are generally paid UP FRONT for their product. Robert started coming back around to his Dad's place when Mr Russell's health started failing. MAYBE JN wanted one of his sons to take up the trade... MAYBE Robert saw all that money up front and it looks like EASY money... GUARANTEED. HOWEVER... what many people fail to realize in producing queens is... there is still a LOT of work involved before you can CASH those cheque... more than most people realize. Many queen producers may START... but I think only a small percentage of them actually stay in it for the long term. Not only is there a lot of work... but a lot of luck with the weather/ your bees strength.. etc etc etc... YES, Mr Russell always used to tell me " IF you can raise a bee you can sell it... but you gotta have the bees" I believe this 100%. Mr Russell raised as many as he could... and as far as I know they were great bees... he had customers for MANY MANY years who came back every year. Many I have met that would drive 1000 miles to pick up their packages or queens... and NO ONE that I know of EVER got screwed from Mr Russell... He would do whatever he could to make sure the customers got what they order and that they were happy.
NOW... did Robert intentionally screw anyone? I really dont know. I would just as soon came back on this forum and seen what a great queen producer he was and congratulated him and said.. HEY.. he is doing good. I used to work for his Daddy... he's got great bees.. etc etc. As the case was... this was not the reality. I have read many post who say they will NEVER buy another Russell queen... and it was THAT statement that caused me to find out what was going on and to post what I did here. I am NOT trying to be unfair or mean to anyone.... give these people their money back and all will be well.... but that is not gonna happen either. SO.. as far as I am concerned... what his family and friends of his family say about him is true... dont believe me?? Call THEM or come see them... you can always share a cold one with Johnny in the shop and he will tell you anything you wanna know.
As for the satellite people selling under Russell's name... I dont know anything about these deals.... dont know anything about any satellite reseller out there, and I have never said ANYTHING negative about any of them.... My OPINION is they just got caught up in all of this before the bottom dropped.
There are some people who thank me... some people who said they tried to say the same as I say but were slammed before.... and some people who say they have had nothing but great experience from Robert.... SO... all I can say is what has been said. Had I KNOWN how this would have turned out.... I would never had said a word. Let the buyer beware.... someone gonna sell you ocean property in Arizona... I hope you get a good view.
Maybe to Robert the idea of raising Queens far exceeded his willingness to do the WORK to raise queens. Maybe he is better suited for marketing.. :) I will admit... he has done a HECK of a job in THAT area.

In the old days we used to do this - mostly on tailgator - usually around Christmas and New years, Poor Barry would give us fair warning - we seldom heeded and often had to shut down the thread for a month or so. In honor of all the good Barry brings on to us all and all the headaches we give him I am stating the obvious here as stated many times over the years.

It's Janaury - Cabin fever has set in and we are all going stir crazy waiting for spring - worrying about our bees - and getting a little on the punchy side - perhaps our time would be better spent on productive posts where we all have someing positive to share. I am at least certain I am not seeing things clearly so I will hence go to other areas of reading and posting!

What we say about the theft, the Russells or anything other than how we will do our best beekeeping in 2013 really is nothing but grist for a non-productive mill unless it helps solve the problem.

Thing I don't get about this version of events, is that Robert was not around but supposedly showed up shortly before his Dad's death, grabbed some hives and started selling bees.

However from back when Robert used to post on Beesource, it was obvious he had a pretty extensive knowledge of bees. His opinions were sometimes out there, and he believed in Lamarkian Evolution which was a bit hard for some to swallow, and I can't comment on the way he ran his business. But none the less, in my opinion his knowledge could have only come about by extensive experience.

How can that tally with he just showed up grabbed some hives and started posting on Beesource?

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Originally Posted by camero7

Just curious why you two are so adamant and concerned with defending someone who has stiffed so many people.

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Hi Camero, I guess it does look I might be supporting Robert but for the record I'm not. My last post on this but I certainly don't support anyone who stiffed numerous beekeeepers whatever the reason and in that respect you are correct that no one should be, whatever else is going on everyone here works too hard for their money and really gives alot to the craft in the field and here.

I too got cheated out of my money. So I went through all the steps to file a complaint with the Miss. attorney general.A few weeks later the attorney general sent me a letter saying they were dropping the investigation because no one from the buiness picked up the registered letter they sent them. If you want to cheat someone in Mississippi just don't pick up the letter the attorney general sends you. Unbelievable! I know this is old news, but what I really want to know is there any breeder who will send a small number of queens say 2-4. I live in Texas in African bee area and without requeening I will have to quit beekeeping. I have tried odering from several breeders, but usually they get canceled. thanks

Mr Genecot.. I must work a day job until May... but after I get home I am planning to raise as many queens as I can... for myself mostly... but I GUARANTEE YOU... if you can still use queens in JUNE... You will get them ( if you want 'em )... I'll even give you the first 4 FREE if you pay to ship em... I MIGHT can get you queens before then, but gotta check on that first. As a minimum... you can have 4 off my first run if you want them... I would like your feedback on whatever I send you put here on Beesource though... good or bad or otherwise...just your honest opinion of them after you give em a test run...

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Originally Posted by Joel

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What we say about the theft, the Russells or anything other than how we will do our best beekeeping in 2013 really is nothing but grist for a non-productive mill unless it helps solve the problem.

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As the old commercial stated..."THANKS!!! I needed that!!!!!"

Thanks for the reality check, Joel.

Ed

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Originally Posted by Oldtimer

But none the less, in my opinion his knowledge could have only come about by extensive experience.

How can that tally with he just showed up grabbed some hives and started posting on Beesource?

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That's exactly what I was saying on page 1, post 15.

I hear what all of you are saying... and in regards to his knowledge, I dont know what he knows.. he might can talk good, or he might really know bees... but I CAN SAY.. every person here in Hinds county MS that I know of that knows him says he never went to college... and does NOT have a doctorate degree in entomology.... they all say he has a BS degree... and I DON't mean bachelor of science. If someone who KNOWS first hand could please tell us what school he graduated.. a simple phone call to the registrar could answer this simple question. IF he does indeed have his doctorate... then most everything else I have said becomes VERY questionable I admit.... but then again someone who is PRETENDING to have a doctor's degree... uses Dr. as his name prefix.... well... that might well start making believers out of some of ya.
When I worked with JN Russell.... there was JN... and Ron Miller.. they were kind of partnering at the time.... there was myself and my wife at the time... and there was a young guy who ran honey with his dad that helped sometimes also to learn queen rearing.. Their name was JT Crownover.. his dad is Luther Crownover of Crownover honey.... ALL of these people are out of bees now... except ME. but you can ask any of them where was Robert between 2004-2007... and he wasn't around Russell Apiaries in Bolton MS. How or where he got his knowledge I dont know... and his knowledge may be genuine.... I take most people's word here that KNOW bees and were convinced he knew what he was talking about... so he knew something. But I read his website and I cant finish a single paragraph without reading SOME kind of EXTREME exaggeration or just plain outright lie.
As I have stated several times... if he had sent queens to those that sent him money.. OR.. had he returned their money after not filling their orders.... this thread would not exist.. at least by ME.
I also told before about my own experience.. a company sent me color brochures, official letters of commitment, letter from a marketing company guaranteeing a customer base, etc etc etc.... I swallowed the hook... sent them $5000 cheque... that is $5000 REAL MONEY from my bank. I never saw a single thing... never got a penny back.. they filed bankruptcy <30 days after they got my cheque. SO.. I KNOW How some of these people here feel.

Where is Robert??? Can anyone here contact him??? Can Anyone ask him to PLEASE come here and show I am very mistaken at the least??? What school did he graduate from??? Please let us verify his credentials so all of this can come to a close!!

AND... BTW... I Absolutely Positively Astronomically AND Unquestionably HATE A LIAR.... mis-statements I can understand... honest mistakes I can understand.... people who make a genuine effort I can have sympathy.... but for ANYONE who tries to get me to swallow a pile of cow dung... I WILL NEVER NEVER NEVER HAVE SYMPATHY, OR RETREAT!!

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Originally Posted by MSBEEINSPECTOR

SippyBees (all of them) & Major (01-17-2013 10:55 AM #13) have stated the truth of the facts.

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Can someone please elaborate on this statement; am I reading posts from multiple contributors under the same pen-name/user account? That's the impression that MSBEEINSPECTOR is giving.

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Originally Posted by MSBEEINSPECTOR

As I stated last year I will not speak of specifics dealing with a case on a public forum, but I did send the appropiate documentation concerning our (State of MS) cases against Robert Russell to Barry.

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I think what Joel is commenting about is the statement above. If I was under investigation/charges and someone had this information and sent it to any individual, I would have my lawyer all over those people and I'm sure in the end I would have money in my pocket and no charges pending. but I really do appreciate the threads during the winter as I do get bored at times:applause:

Mike, You can't see any reason someone being sent "appropriate documentation" would be proper procedure in an investigation?

FWIW- I bought queens from him twice and got them both times.

Mike, what I received is public information. It has nothing to do with any on going investigations. I think this was already made clear.

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Originally Posted by Barry

Mile, what I received is public information. It has nothing to do with any on going investigations. I think this was already made clear.

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Barry,

Since it is public information why don't you share it with all of us. I like to base my opinions on facts with supporting documentation. Thanks

Giddyup dead horse, giddyup!

Because decorum dictates that I don't. Even though I knew about Robert's (step?)brother's public record, I don't feel it's my place to broadcast it. I already mentioned where you can get the information.

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Originally Posted by Barry

Mile, what I received is public information. It has nothing to do with any on going investigations. I think this was already made clear.

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I thought that the use of all caps, as if yelling, was against the rules. Yet Sippy's Posts are rife w/ them. What's the Policy?

Am I ever thankful that I don't have any bees in this swarm!