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Paint/Stain What do you use/How long is it lasting?

21K views 68 replies 43 participants last post by  toekneepea 
#1 ·
Got a bunch of new equipment (ponderosa pine from Kelleys) for the spring and want to get opinions on what you use and more important, how long it lasts.

Thanks
 
#2 ·
#9 ·
I think Kelley is actually cheaper if you buy it by the gal. Home Depot is if you want 5 gal. I'd recommend getting 1 gal to start with. It makes plenty. I wouldn't be shocked if you could treat 40 to 50+ boxes with 1 gal. I recommend applying to the exterior of boxes before assembly. Some people dip em, I just lay them out flat on my tailgate and apply with a foam brush. You'll think you got gypped at first, because nothing happens, but after getting rained on 1 time it transitions nicely to the color SueBeeTN posted.
 
#10 ·
We foud semi-gloss latex was the easiest to use and the longest lasting until a few years ago someone got sent for paint and came back with 5 gallons of stain. clean up was a hassel but clearly it sunk into the wood and after 4 years afield we are using stain for all new woodwork. A couple of things to consider with paint is color. Darker colored paints were shown to increase hive temps and have a negative impact on varroa and also helped in keeping hives hidden in outyards or suburban areas where the sight of bright white beehives might bring unwanted attention.
 
#13 ·
It is self priming. You could save a little money by going to some type of dedicated primer like Zinsser or the like if you would choose. Two well applied coats will usually do the trick.
 
#14 ·
I have been putting Titebond III on all end grain, knots and nail holes. Then I apply two coats of Zinsser and then two coats of Menards exterior (don't remember the brand) white, semi-gloss latex. I don't have enough history to know how it will work. About 3 weeks ago I tried burning the grain of some hives and applied 3 coats of marine varnish. They look much nicer than the white painted ones, but we will see how they last.
 
#37 ·
I have been putting Titebond III on all end grain, knots and nail holes. Then I apply two coats of Zinsser and then two coats of Menards exterior (don't remember the brand) white, semi-gloss latex. I don't have enough history to know how it will work. About 3 weeks ago I tried burning the grain of some hives and applied 3 coats of marine varnish. They look much nicer than the white painted ones, but we will see how they last.
Just curios Leonard, how are the marine varnished ones holding up?
 
#19 ·
It is a powder that you mix, but you do not have to dip boxes. Before assembling new equipment I get a foam brush and apply to the outside and let dry. I don't like to dip because I want to leave the inside natural. But on another thread here on Beesource someone contacted the company and they said that it would be safe for the bees if the wood treatment was applied to the inside of the hive. I can't vouch for how long it will work because I've only had mine on my boxes for a couple of seasons, but so far there is no deterioration. I prefer the look compared to painted boxes, and as was mentioned earlier it is much less labor intensive.
 
#20 ·
Ahhh the age old question, to paint, stain, etc. This is what we do and it works for us.

We build our own boxes out of pine and brand every panel before assembly using the drill press method. During assembly we use Titebond III on the joints and fasten them using 7/16x1.5" galvanized staples via a Senco pneumatic stapler. Once the glue dries we prepare a batch of Eco Treatment. It comes in a powder form and we make 5-10 gallons at a shot using distilled water. The reason for the distilled water is that it will store in solution longer without worry, per the manufacturer. In addition, for each gallon of mix we add about 5 ounces (a little more than 1/2 a cup) of water based dye, which can be purchased at your local paint or big box store. The reason for the dye is to further distinguish our equipment even though it is branded. We use browns and greens to blend in with the surroundings and to warrant a clean look. Eco is poured into a large pan and each super is rotated through the solution. The interior and the sides all get coated. We treat all equipment the same. Yes it uses a lot of eco treatment, but compare the product cost to the labor cost of paining equipment. Plus the eco allows for the branding to stand out.

The average lifespan of a super, in our opinion is 10 years. We stopped dealing with paint for several reasons, but the main reason being that one day a large chip of oil based paint lodged itself under a finger nail. From that point on, no more paint.
 
#22 ·
Ten years isn't very long -- my brother's "old" hive will be eight years old this year, and we are thinking it might need another coat of paint.

The Behr Ultra-Premium is wonderful stuff -- very easy to apply and dries very hard, unlike some other paints I've used that never really seem to set properly, you can peel them off with a fingernail.

Sealed, primed, and properly painted boxes should last quite a while so long as you don't pry on the rabbet or leave them out in the rain without a proper cover. You will need to repaint every ten years or so.

More important is to make absolutely positive that the end grain is sealed and that the box joints do not have open gaps. I finally quit screwing around with my old box joint jig after nearly ruining a couple boxes tonight and made a new one. Perfect this time, the joints require a tap with a mallet to fit completely together, which means a small amount of glue will seal them properly.

I suspect the eco-treatment is milk paint without filler. If so, it should last quite a while. I still prefer paint, mainly because my boxes have knots!

Peter
 
#41 ·
I suspect the eco-treatment is milk paint without filler. If so, it should last quite a while. I still prefer paint, mainly because my boxes have knots!

Peter
I believe it is some sort of iron treatment. Check out this thread:
http://www.beesource.com/forums/showthread.php?278456-ECO-Wood-Treatment

Anyway, it is not a milk paint. I "painted" my top bar hive in the ECO Wood Treatment (inside and out) and it seems to be doing ok.... only 1 year old though. My hive is pine, and I found out a little too late that it is not recommended for pine, but it sure does look beautiful!

My new hive is cypress. I'll probably use the ECO treatment on it and paint it to be extra cautious.

Can you now get the ECO Wood Treatment at HD in the US?? When I bought it is was only available in stores in Canada. I had to order it online. I'd rather order it from a beekeeping supplier if I had to order more... just to support a smaller business.
 
#23 ·
I think sometimes we put in too much effort worrying about stuff like paint/stain types. I have a stack of boxes that have whitewash on them and are dated from the early 50s. I still keep bees in them. I did try painting over some of them, but paint doesn't stick well to layers of whitewash.
 
#25 · (Edited)
Funny, when I was researching paints, I found no brand so consistently hated as Behr. I really have no experience with it myself. I was scared off by the reviews. Interesting to read about happy cutomers here though - I guess you never know until you try things.

I ended up using Sico solid stain in a dark brown.

Can you paint or stain over Eco Wood treatment?

Adam
 
#27 ·
Perhaps this link won't work for most as access to ratings need a membership (about the best $20 you will ever spend). In short it shows Behr and Glidden as the top rated paints in the semi-gloss (unless you choose to spend $60 per gallon for Sherwin Williams.
http://www.consumerreports.org/cro/...s/exterior-paint-ratings/ratings-overview.htm
Don: I can't vouch for every Behr product but I will just say that as an independent testing lab (that is beholding to no one) Consumer Reports generally rates Behr and California paint products very highly. It's a bit odd in my mind because I don't have a very high opinion of the overall quality of products sold in HD
 
#30 ·
They rate them after 3, 6, and 9 years of exposure. The only Benjamin Moore products they have tested are still in the early testing stages but look good to this point. The magazine article this past June has some additional info not on the web site. They only have a limited number of products in their testing program, don't know why. Their test results were the reason I first tried them and seeing the results really sold me.
 
#29 ·
To those using stain. Does the stronger smell of oil-based stain affect the bees? We had some one in our club use stain last spring, and when he opened the back of his car, the smell was overwhelming, and he had stained them two WEEKS before (they sure were pretty, though).
 
#31 ·
If you are going to use stain you have to allow them to completely dry and off gas. Depending on weather could be upwards of 6 weeks.

Let me clarify our 10 year opinion on the life of a super. From a business perspective 10 years is what we use as a maximum for woodenware replacement. Constant moving takes its wear and tear on boxes and we take pride in our equipment. We repair and replace as necessary - it is usually less expensive to replace if you pay labor. As a marketing tool, our hives look pristine, we keep medication records, and have a method to inventory our equipment. If you were looking for pollination services would you tend to contract out to someone who's boxes are falling apart and look worn, or would you tend to think that nice boxes, well maintained equipment, lots of bees and a high level of professionalism offers more? It's not only about having healthy bees - perception plays a large role especially if you want those corporate farm contracts. Remember there are many external factors that effect wooden ware lifespan.

I am not saying what we do is right or is the best method, all I can report is what we do and what works for us. Even after 25 years there is still a learning curve and a more efficient approach. Always be improving in order to exceed survival.
 
#32 ·
Let me clarify our 10 year opinion on the life of a super. From a business perspective 10 years is what we use as a maximum for woodenware replacement. Constant moving takes its wear and tear on boxes and we take pride in our equipment.
So you are saying all equipment is routinely replaced after 10 years?
 
#34 ·
I've been experimenting with numerous paints and stains. I have a gallon of Behr (purchased as an "oops" can) and thought that something was wrong as it was so thick compared to other paints. I just put it on thick and as it dried it seemed to soak into the wood. I was really impressed with how easily it went on and I put on two coats. So far, it is doing very well. The only place I am having problems is where I painted over joints sealed up with exterior wood filler. I'm inclined to think that is a problem with the filler (Elmer's) and not with the Behr paint. (I've recently begun using some Red Devil Crack Patch "premium acrylic spackling" to see how well it holds up. I've read recently about using bondo and may try that, as well.)

As I said, Behr is THICK - the thickest I've ever used - at least, until I got some Cabot Solid Acrylic "Stain". Now, that stuff is REALLY thick - like painting with Pepsodent. But it, too, soaks in really well and allows for two coats. A local big box had 5 1-gallon cans of that Cabot solid stain for just a smidgen over $2 per can on the oops rack. I couldn't resist for that price and plus the fact that it is white.

FWIW, I've tried some Glidden and found that it inhales rather sharply, if you know what I mean. The worst I've tried so far is some from Wal-Mart.

Maybe in a few years I can report back on what works in my area and what doesn't.

-js
 
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