Formic Treatment

[Scorpster]

I gave a flash formic treatment last week at dusk, entrances reduced but upper entrance open. I gave no more than 45ml each (double deeps) but when I went out 4 hours later, there were dead bees all around, maybe 100 per hive, so I removed the entrance reducer. Does this sound normal or should I open the bottom entrance before treatment next time? I'm not too concerned about the 100 bees, but I hate to risk the queen. Of course on the other hand I also want the treatment to be effective.

How long after a flash treatment do I need to wait to do an accurate mite drop check?

Since I don't know if I have tracheal mites, should I just stick to a 7 day schedule for treatments?

[honeyshack]

from what i know of the flash treatment and this is from talking to other beekeepers and the beekeepers meeting, not suppose to reduce the entrances. It would be to hard on the bees

As well, HBH is place on paper towel on the top of the frames to aid in getting the bees though this.
Rob Currie, and his team at the Manitoba University did a study with different treatments, and found that the longer treatment of formic was a better control for varroa that the flash treatment. The flash treatment was more of a stop gap measure until fall. There tests indicated that the mites in the capped cells were not contolled very well, especially in the thicker darker comb. Howevery, after talking with some of the manitoba beekeepers at this meeting, they seemed to like the control they got. This was before the spring work up got under way, and i have not heard how they faired this spring.
In all honesty I do not know when to get an accurate mite drop. Might want to try one right away and then another a week later...

[Scorpster]

I was hoping that having an upper entrance open it would compensate for having an entrance reducer on. After looking at the mite drops I am guessing it was too soon, there were about 100 after 3 days, however unlike previous tests, none were alive. Not enough time for another test before the next treatment but I will wait longer next time. Check out this link for some results of testing flash vs pads.
http://www.reineschapleau.wd1.net/articles/flash.en.html

[jean-marc]

If you are using his screened bottom boards the follow his instructions, no entrance reducers , there is a slight lip in those bottoms boards to retain the formic fumes, and no upper entrances.

J-P Chapleau has come up with a great system, so no need to try and modify things. His system is used by amateurs in Quebec and Ontario. I think more and more commercial guys use it there as well. There has not been a lot of acceptance of his system out west. Not sure why, I think it's great. The bottom boards are too flimsy for my liking, but the system is great. I especially like the seasonal flow charts. The strength of the system is that it tells you to take such and such action at such and such time if you have such and such number of mites falling naturally. In this case the taxpayer money was well spent. Of course that opinion comes from a beekeeping friendly minset.

Jean-Marc

[Scorpster]

My BB's are similar to the Apinovars, with the "drawer" installed the cavity under the screen is closed in (not quite air tight but bee tight). I just came in from inspecting the hives 4 hours after another flash treatment, no entrance reducers and upper entrance open. Once again lots of dead bees, one hive at least 200. Once again a max of 45ml each of 65%. Guess I'll have to reduce the dose next time, or try the wipe method.

[Ishi]

Try it at about daylight so that the bees can fly. This should reduce the dead bees , or maybe they just fly off and you do not see them. Cut back to 40cc.

[jean-marc]

Not sure , but I believe the dosage is supposed to be smaller. 30 ml I believe. I am going by memory. Drawers should be more or less air tight.Temperatures were pretty high that day, which also factors in. I'd worry more about how many varroa are being killed.

Jean-Marc

[Scorpster]

After the mite drop test I did after the first treatment (lots of DEAD mites), as opposed to other times where lots of the mites were still active, I am going to assume some were killed while capped. I was wondering about the colouration of the mites that are just hatching. How dark would a mite be that was killed before it hatches? I think my dosage is pretty close to guidelines, and am sure that I was short on the last hive and still had good die off. Next time I might try 20ml on the bottom board and another dose from the top, maybe on a wipe. If I am killing mites in the brood, I guess I will have to wait 2 weeks to get an accurate mite drop count then? I am going to do a full inspection tommorrow, hopefully the queens will be ok, the hives seem to be acting normal. Do you still have queens available at this time of year Jean-Marc? Just in case :)