Reversing Boxes

[applebwoi]

I've been mostly overwintering with three mediums. The bottom box is usually totally empty by this time of early spring and the upper two have various amounts of stores. What is the general opinion about reversing boxes, i.e., moving the bottom to the top and droppingt the other two down? I only have about 10 hives right now so it won't be that difficult. However, if the bees will eventually move down and fill the bottom box again with brood, then I'm more than happy not to mess with them. When I begin adding additional supers, I have never used an excluder. Seems like moving the empty bottom box up top will allow the queen to have an entire box to fill before she might think about moving on up to the supers I add.

[RayMarler]

Puting the box of mostly honey on the bottom, and the mostly empty on top is how I would do it. That's just me.

With this arrangement, it will help to reduce swarming tendencies because there is no layer of honey on top, and is empty space on top to move honey to. With the honey on the bottom, they will use it for feed and move what's not needed for broodfeed up to the empty top box. I'd think they'll use the bottom two boxes for brood and the top for honey more readily this way.

A Year's Work In An Out-Apiary by G. M. Doolittle gives good examples and reasons for this, is a great read, and can be purchased at http://www.wicwas.com

[dcross]

I would pull it to go through and cull the oldest/worst combs, replace them with undrawn and then put it on top because it was easiest:)

[tecumseh]

I reverse boxes quite often, but certainly the most important time to do this is in the spring. my main object is to clean off the bottom board and move the brood cluster downward. if you still can expect some cold weather you might wish to do as ray has suggested as this would give some distance between the brood and a drafty front door. if the queen has already move down (about 50% of the time) I just scrape the bottom board, knock off any pieces of propolis and set the hive back on as it was sittlng originally.

I incorporate two other manipulation into this reversals:

1) it is somewhat common here to find one frame on either or both sides of the brood nest to be a solid sheet of pollen. this limits brood nest expansion horizontally since the girls are not so inclined to move pollen. I shift these 'towards' the outside wall and move an empty in to fill the void.

2)in hive with good provisions I 'somewhat' checkerboard above the brood nest...that is if you have a box of solid honey rather than set it in place as is above the brood nest (which then can act as limitation on brood nest expansion vertically) I will alternate feed frames with empty frames. this can also provide one to several frames of excess provision which I then share with the less well provisioned hives.

[Ben Brewcat]

I do exactly as Tecumseh describes. They move up a LOT easier than down in my experience. But I also pull old or poor combs and replace with foundationless frames before putting on top; I drone trap for Varroa so this meets multiple goals (drone trapping, opening up for swarm prevention, drawing new brood comb).

[Michael Bush]

I generally don't move any boxes up, but if it's empty it won't hurt. If it has brood in both bottom boxes it will break up the brood nest and I don't think that's productive.

[BEES4U]

I reversed a hive last week so that I could place a pollen patty between the boxes and pour fumagillin syrup in the combs above the patty.
Ernie

[candlaman]

Would you explain "foundationless frames"? I assume they are just a wooden frame with no foundation. I have tried that when I have gotten behind wiyh swarm collection and ended up with one whale of a mess. Sure sounds easier than putting wax in frames if it works. Thanks, Candlaman

[Michael Bush]

>Would you explain "foundationless frames"? I assume they are just a wooden frame with no foundation.

No. They are frames with some kind of comb guide:
http://www.bushfarms.com/beesfoundationless.htm

[Ben Brewcat]

In my usage I don't use comb guides, but I'm putting frames between drawn combs and they've been drawn out before so the bees usually put it right in place without an additional guide.

[abeeco]

ben (or others) -
when you use old frames for foundationless do you cut out the old comb leaving a small row or half row of cells or similar or are you completley removing the old wax (for cycling out of operation, etc)

why are you doing this are you sterilizing combs for disease, getting rid of comb contamination or just cut comb honey etc?

thank you!

[Ben Brewcat]

I just run the hive tool along the inside of the frame to cut out the comb; if a little gets left no big deal. I don't do anything with the frames but put them back in to be redrawn.