Acorn

[BULLSEYE BILL]

Could there be enough fraud that congress could suspend the election?

[dragonfly]

I doubt it. There's probably too many congressmen and women who benefit from their services.

[Ruben]

I wish I were a kid again, back when acorns meant the deer had something good to eat :)

Acorn is corruption like all government these days!

[Eaglerock]

Could there be enough fraud that congress could suspend the election?

GWB could suspend the election if we go to war with Iran... Congress can't suspend the election because of fraud, besides, they do fraud as well. It would be like an Officer driving like an idot and then going to work and giving someone a ticket for the same thing... oh wait, :s I know one that does do that. :doh: Nevermind... carry on... :sleep:

[sqkcrk]

Acorn is corruption like all government these days!

You do know that ACORN is not a government agency, don't you?

[Putz]

could suspend election for national emergency, and i bet a bad economic crash could be called by bush and buddies a national emergency. just thinking outloud here.

[MapMan]

Some background on Obama's associations with ACORN and our tax dollars at work:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122394051071230749.html?mod=special_page_campaig n2008_mostpop


MM

[Galaxy]

Congress can't suspend the election because of fraud, besides, they do fraud as well. It would be like an Officer driving like an idot and then going to work and giving someone a ticket for the same thing... oh wait, :s I know one that does do that. :doh: Nevermind... carry on... :sleep: So, it appears you know Sarah Palin's former brother-in-law. :shhhh:

[Galaxy]

You do know that ACORN is not a government agency, don't you?They will be if Obama is elected.

[MapMan]

Squirrels at work:

http://acornsdontfallfarfromthetree.wordpress.com/



MM

[dragonfly]

Isn't it funny how it seems to be the "battleground" states that have the most corruption being carried on by this organization?:(

[MapMan]

Isn't it funny how it seems to be the "battleground" states that have the most corruption being carried on by this organization?:(

Yes - quite a coinkydink. :scratch:

MM

[dragonfly]

Bullseye, here's more about ACORN that you particularly and probably others may be interested in:

http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/ACORN-Uses-Public-Funds-Steal/story.aspx?guid=%7B239A0F78-0111-48F9-9A6C-896E29D38602%7D

[Sundance]

This Acorn distraction is just that......... a major distraction
with an underlying attempt to preface voter nullification.

It's the "look the other way" non-issue to avoid facing the
truly important issues of our time. Like health care, and the
floundering economy.

[Bodo]

This Acorn distraction is just that......... a major distraction
with an underlying attempt to preface voter nullification.


So you condone fraudulant voter registration to attempt to sway an election?

[Sundance]

So you condone fraudulant voter registration to attempt to sway an election?

Absolutely not. Nor do I condone making a fairly small issue
a major story by embellishment, and stretching the truth.

Spending a boat load of money on an Acorn campaign to
make it sound like a major, widespread problem is abhorrent.

There were a few individuals that did the wrong thing. They
should be handled individually. Small taters folks........

It is simply a preemptive move to try for voter nullification. One
of the cronies behind this was the same shyster that got several
AG's fired and finally AG Gonzalez.

http://www.acorn.org/index.php?id=16857


It is simple............. Provide me with a factual number
of "voter fraud" incidents.

[iddee]

I was in the cafe having breakfast this morning, and, as always, politics were the topic. One well known democrat was saying about the same thing on several Obama concerns, when one guy said...

"Pete, you would vote for bin laden before you would vote republican. You hide from any info against any democrat."

I think we have a few "Petes" on Beesource.

[iddee]

>>>>It is simple............. Provide me with a factual number
of "voter fraud" incidents.<<<<

One should be sufficient. That's all it takes to break federal law.

[JPK1NH]

The Democrat AG in Ohio admits that there are over 200,000 registrations that are in question.

There's a county in Alabama (iirc) that has more people registered to vote than there are in the county.

There are individuals that have stood in front of a judge and admitted that they registered in excess of 70 times.

There sure are a lot of people named "Pete" here and a lot of Kool Aide.

[Sundance]

Some Pete's and lots of John Birch's.......

[iddee]

When you have no defense, ATTACK!!!

[JPK1NH]

Some Pete's and lots of John Birch's.......

The former being the problem and the latter a decent solution.....too bad so many Liberals are seemingly incurable and will never open their eyes enough to see that MORE government is the problem not the solution.

One of the biggest problems with Acorn is that its Government Subsidized and like Freddie and Fannie largely run and managed by Democrats.....its NOT a non-partisan group.

[Sundance]

When you have no defense, ATTACK!!!

This would seem to be the mantra of the right wing
at this point...........:doh: You workin' for McCain
Iddee????

[iddee]

I was referring to you, Sundance, as if you didn't already know. :p

Or are you saying you are trying to take up republican habits???
Finally getting smart? :scratch: :D :D

[BULLSEYE BILL]

Thanks DF, I have to agree;

"Public money should not be given to private organizations which then turn around and utilize that funding to usurp the electoral process and erode constitutionally-guaranteed civil rights."

[sqkcrk]

So you condone fraudulant voter registration to attempt to sway an election?

The people who fillout registration forms with false info don't vote or at least if they try they won't pass scrutiny. Filling out forms to get paid is one thing. Showing up to cast an illegal ballot is jail time. Probably Federal jail time. But not in the same prison that Ted Stevens probably won't go to.

[sqkcrk]

>>>>It is simple............. Provide me with a factual number
of "voter fraud" incidents.<<<<

One should be sufficient. That's all it takes to break federal law.

And to sway an election?

[JPK1NH]

The people who fillout registration forms with false info don't vote or at least if they try they won't pass scrutiny. Filling out forms to get paid is one thing. Showing up to cast an illegal ballot is jail time. Probably Federal jail time. But not in the same prison that Ted Stevens probably won't go to.

We'll, both are already federal offenses that carry jail time.....if they went to the trouble of registering then why wouldn't they vote?

Both are a willful act to undermine the election process...do you not understand that?

Stevens is irrelevent to the discussion.

[iddee]

>>>>And to sway an election?<<<<

For that, you have to BUY electoral votes.
Which is likely being done.

[sqkcrk]

We'll, both are already federal offenses that carry jail time.....if they went to the trouble of registering then why wouldn't they vote?

Both are a willful act to undermine the election process...do you not understand that?

Stevens is irrelevent to the discussion.

There are plenty of folks who are legally registered who don't vote, aren't there? Don't you think that it's alot easier to fill out a form than it is to show up to vote? Have you seen the lines of those voting early? Why would someone who fraudulently filed an invalid registration stand in line to attempt to cast an illegal ballot? What's the benefit to them?

I understand that they are willful acts to undermine the election process, but to what degree do we ever see that this happens?

Being concerned is one thing. Being really worried that John McCain won't be elected because of fraudulent registration is unnecessary, IMO. But go ahead if it makes you feel better.

I'll bet a nickel that if McCain is elected there won't be any further persecution of ACORN. Just like the last two elections.

[sqkcrk]

>>>>And to sway an election?<<<<

For that, you have to BUY electoral votes.
Which is likely being done.

How much did McCain pay you for yours?:) And how did his campaign verify that you actually voted the way they payed you to? Not that I really believe that they or you did.

But how would this really happen? Are there people out there who are paying individuals cash money to cast their ballot for a candidate that they wouldn't have voted for in the first place? Who has that kind of money? Where are they? How do they do that?

[iddee]

I think you should look up electoral college.
Then you may be able to comprehend my post.

Our little vote means nothing. It's the electoral votes that choose the pres.

[JPK1NH]

There are plenty of folks who are legally registered who don't vote, aren't there? Don't you think that it's alot easier to fill out a form than it is to show up to vote? Have you seen the lines of those voting early? Why would someone who fraudulently filed an invalid registration stand in line to attempt to cast an illegal ballot? What's the benefit to them?

Here's the observation....its just as easy to fill out a registration form fraudulently as it is to fill out an absentee ballot and mail it in....have you looked at how many so called "People" are voting this way this year?....hmmmm

I understand that they are willful acts to undermine the election process, but to what degree do we ever see that this happens?

Mark, how many votes decided the last election in Fla?

Even one fraudulent vote is too many.

Voter Registration should only be allowed at town/city hall and proof of identification must be required.....enough of this poop already.

Being concerned is one thing. Being really worried that John McCain won't be elected because of fraudulent registration is unnecessary, IMO. But go ahead if it makes you feel better.

I'll bet a nickel that if McCain is elected there won't be any further persecution of ACORN. Just like the last two elections.

Mark. there are over 200k suspect registrations in Ohio alone....that number could easily sway the entire election.....multiply that accross several states and its a rigged election.

Government should not be allowed to spend taxpayer dollars to pay companies to push for increased voter registration....its a bunch of partisan poop.

I hope that the McCain admin prosecutes the heck out of them if he wins.

[JPK1NH]

An Acorn Whistleblower Testifies in Court

An Acorn Whistleblower Testifies in Court
The group's ties to Obama are extensive.
By JOHN FUND
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB122533169940482893.html

Acorn, the liberal "community organizing" group that claims it will deploy 15,000 get-out-the-vote workers on Election Day, can't stay out of the news.

The FBI is investigating its voter registration efforts in several states, amid allegations that almost a third of the 1.3 million cards it turned in are invalid. And yesterday, a former employee of Acorn testified in a Pennsylvania state court that the group's quality-control efforts were "minimal or nonexistent" and largely window dressing. Anita MonCrief also says that Acorn was given lists of potential donors by several Democratic presidential campaigns, including that of Barack Obama, to troll for contributions.

The Obama campaign denies it "has any ties" to Acorn, but Mr. Obama's ties are extensive. In 1992 he headed a registration effort for Project Vote, an Acorn partner at the time. He did so well that he was made a top trainer for Acorn's Chicago conferences. In 1995, he represented Acorn in a key case upholding the constitutionality of the new Motor Voter Act -- the first law passed by the Clinton administration -- which created the mandated, nationwide postcard voter registration system that Acorn workers are using to flood election offices with bogus registrations.

Ms. MonCrief testified that in November 2007 Project Vote development director Karyn Gillette told her she had direct contact with the Obama campaign and had obtained their donor lists. Ms. MonCrief also testified she was given a spreadsheet to use in cultivating Obama donors who had maxed out on donations to the candidate, but who could contribute to voter registration efforts. Project Vote calls the allegation "absolutely false."

She says that when she had trouble with what appeared to be duplicate names on the list, Ms. Gillette told her she would talk with the Obama campaign and get a better version. Ms. MonCrief has given me copies of the donor lists she says were obtained from other Democratic campaigns, as well as the 2004 DNC donor lists.

In her testimony, Ms. MonCrief says she was upset by Acorn's "Muscle for Money" program, which she said intimidated businesses Acorn opposed into paying "protection" money in the form of grants. Acorn's Brian Kettering says the group only wants to change corporate behavior: "Acorn is proud of its corporate campaigns to stop abuses of working families."

Ms. MonCrief, 29, never expected to testify in a case brought by the state's Republican Party seeking the local Acorn affiliate's voter registration lists. An idealistic graduate of the University of Alabama, she joined Project Vote in 2005 because she thought it was empowering poor people. A strategic consultant for Acorn and a development associate with its Project Vote voter registration affiliate, Ms. MonCrief sat in on policy-making meetings with the national staff. She was fired early this year over personal expenses she had put on the group's credit card.

She says she became disillusioned because she saw that Acorn was run as the personal fiefdom of Wade Rathke, who founded the group in 1970 and ran it until he stepped down to take over its international operations this summer. Mr. Rathke's departure as head of Acorn came after revelations he'd employed his brother Dale for a decade while keeping from almost all of Acorn's board members the fact that Dale had embezzled over $1 million from the group a decade ago. (The embezzlement was confirmed to me by an Acorn official.)

"Anyone who questioned what was going on was viewed as the enemy," Ms. MonCrief told me. "Just like the mob, no one leaves Acorn happily." She believes the organization does some good but hopes its current leadership is replaced. She may not be alone.

Last August two of Acorn's eight dissident board members, Marcel Reed and Karen Inman, filed suit demanding access to financial records of Citizens Consulting Inc., the umbrella group through which most of Acorn's money flows. Ms. Inman told a news conference this month Mr. Rathke still exercises power over CCI and Acorn against the board's wishes. Bertha Lewis, the interim head of Acorn, told me Mr. Rathke has no ties to Acorn and that the dissident board members were "obsessed" and "confused."

According to public records, the IRS filed three tax liens totaling almost $1 million against Acorn this spring. Also this spring, CCI was paid $832,000 by the Obama campaign for get-out-the-vote efforts in key primary states. In filings with the Federal Election Commission, the Obama campaign listed the payments as "staging, sound, lighting," only correcting the filings after the Pittsburgh Tribune-Review revealed their true nature.

"Acorn needs a full forensic audit," Ms. MonCrief says, though she doesn't think that's likely. "Everyone wants to paper things over until later," she says. "But it may be too late to reform Acorn then." She strongly supports Barack Obama and hopes his allies can be helpful in cleaning up the group "after the heat of the election is gone."

Acorn's Mr. Kettering says the GOP lawsuit "is designed to suppress legitimate voters," and he says Ms. MonCrief isn't credible, given that she was fired for cause. Ms. MonCrief admits that she left after she began paying back some $3,000 in personal expenses she charged on an Acorn credit card. "I was very sorry, and I was paying it back," she says, but "suddenly Acorn decided that . . . I had to go. Since then I have gotten warnings to 'back off' from people at Acorn."

Acorn insists it operates with strict quality controls, turning in, as required by law, all registration forms "even if the name on them was Donald Duck," as Wade Rathke told me two years ago. Acorn whistleblowers tell a different story.

"There's no quality control on purpose, no checks and balances," says Nate Toler, who worked until 2006 as the head organizer of an Acorn campaign against Wal-Mart in California. And Ms. MonCrief says it is longstanding practice to blame bogus registrations on lower-level employees who then often face criminal charges, a practice she says Acorn internally calls "throwing folks under the bus."

Gregory Hall, a former Acorn employee, says he was told on his very first day in 2006 to engage in deceptive fund-raising tactics. Mr. Hall has founded a group called Speaking Truth to Power to push for a full airing of Acorn's problems "so the group can heal itself from within."

To date, Mr. Obama has declined to criticize Acorn, telling reporters this month he is happy with his own get-out-the-vote efforts and that "we don't need Acorn's help." That may be true. But there is no denying his ties with Acorn helped turbocharge his political career.

Mr. Fund is a columnist for WSJ.com.