Inner cover holes.

[Oldbee]

The inner covers have that oval hole that has been there for MANY years [I assume] provided by the manufacturers of beekeeping supplies; right? It is for the those 'bee escapes' mostly.

My question: Would it be of any benefit to BLOCK OFF that central hole with a moisture absorbing material like homosote and drill 4 [1 inch holes] near the 4 corners of an inner cover to provide ventilation? My thinking is that the warm/humid air from the central part of the cluster will not be lost [ so/too much] during the winter. My hives will have additional ventilation holes under the telescoping cover. Just an experiment/question?

It seems to me that having that hole directly over a cluster of bees that would normally be centrally located in a hive, would only serve to increase the flow of warm air away from the cluster and increase the stress during a winter in the Midwest.

[Eaglerock]

You could just take it off and let them seal the top cover on tight. To keep all the heat in. Or place a piece of plywood under the top cover.

[Oldbee]

Take what off??

Plywood under the top cover? I still need to provide moisture 'ventilation' so I was wondering if the holes on the corners would be BETTER than the hole in the center of an inner cover? I notice, even today, warmth coming from that central hole over the cluster as it gets colder here. Would there be any benefit to block that hole over the center of the cluster?

[Michael Palmer]

My question: Would it be of any benefit to BLOCK OFF that central hole with a moisture absorbing material like homosote and drill 4 [1 inch holes] near the 4 corners of an inner cover to provide ventilation? My thinking is that the warm/humid air from the central part of the cluster will not be lost [ so/too much] during the winter. My hives will have additional ventilation holes under the telescoping cover. Just an experiment/question?

I block mine off with duct tape, and use foam insulation as insulation. I have no additional holes in the inner cover to allow moisture to escape upwards, or any absorbent material. Instead, I use the notch in the inner cover rim as my upper entrance and vent. Because there is insulation on the inner cover, moisture doesn't condense there, but exits the hive out the upper entrance...where it belongs.

Wet insulation is no insulation.

[Oldbee]

OK. What I have done is use that 1-1/2 inch shim for formic acid and drill 2, 1/2 inch holes on opposite sides; screened. I have put homosote on top of the inner cover with space for the central opening. Now, I want to cover that opening that seems to me, would draw warm air from the cluster unneccessarily. Holes at the four corners of the inner cover would allow for moisture to escape but slow the release of warmth for the cluster.

I have read that the bees do not warm the whole hive but only the cluster. With holes at the four corners of the inner cover, would this be of benefit to the cluster or,.. 'of no use at all' and only nonsense?

[Putz]

Makes sense to me OldBee, but that's not saying much as I don't use inner covers or telescoping covers, just migratory covers myself. And, I'm in the great California valley where we don't have many real winters. :D

[Michael Palmer]

I have read that the bees do not warm the whole hive but only the cluster. With holes at the four corners of the inner cover, would this be of benefit to the cluster or,.. 'of no use at all' and only nonsense?

In WI...I would say "Of no use at all."

[papar]

i have seen a beekeeper winter his hives with a wooden hive top feeder topped with a screen in place of the inner cover. He puts several sheets of news paper together, cut the exact size of the screen, placing the newspaper on top of the screen, then top the thing with a standard outter cover- He claims that the moisture of the hive is collected in the news paper, then as spring approaches the bees draw the water back off the newspaper. Once the paper dries out, and before the bees really start flying in spring, he begins giving the bees water with just a drop of bleach inside the feeders- he claims the bees really suck this water down in the early spring which seems to give them a really nice boost.
This beekeeper has additional things he does to get his hives through the winter but those details are not related to the topic. I will say that he is usually 100% successful getting hives through the winter but invests a lot of time doing this.

[seamuswildhoney]

what is his thinking behind the bleach? Tell us more about the part, no winter loss.


where does this Guy live, Equador?

[Troy]

I had read elsewhere that some use a few drops of bleach in the sugar syrup to prevent (or delay) the mildew/fungus.

I've been using the Honey B Healthy, and it is seems to prevent the syrup form going bad for a long time.

[Oldbee]

Thanks everyone for replies. I might try this with one hive; holes at the four corners and the middle one [inner cover] blocked off. There will be ventilation above of course.

It's too bad there are no detailed descriptions of cut-outs of colonies that survive a winter in the northern states, [or southern] whether from trees or buildings. Has a 'project' like this ever been done? For those that do cut-outs in northern states, don't you think some check list or description of the parameters of successful wild colonies would be of value?

Example: What is the space above a successful wild colony like; a description in trees or
buildings?

What is the space below a successful wild colony? Does it [naturally] provide for
mite drop?
How does a successful wild colony provide for ventilation and moisture release; is
there more than one entrance/exit and where are they located? Thanks.

[papar]

that is his claim. From what he tells, he was having issue with a neighbors pool and the bees preferring it over the watering setup he had in the apiary. He constantly changed the water and tried to do everything to keep them from it then decided to put a drop or two of bleach in his bird baths that he uses for watering bees, and they immediately started to drink from it. Over time he began to experiment and came to the conclusion that the bees used this componant of bleach as some type of aid. As a side note I will tell you that I've heard of some using it in sugar water as a way to treat nosema ceranae.

Additionally, he makes a cover that goes around all four sides of the hive. Its made of high density fiber board and large enough to allow a half inch air space all around the hive, upper and lower holes in the front.
He also manages his mite population w/powdered sugar until honey supers are added, he then waits until the end of the season when all the brood hatches and flash treats until he has few mites on the board after 72 hrs. treatment usually doesn't last longer then a week.
He also runs a screen bottom board with a bottom that is at least 3 inches from the screen and is dilagentabout cleaning the tray. Lots of little things that made his winter successes.
There are so many factors in getting your bees through the winter beyond vetilation. I've seen some that have vents all over and others with everything sealed and even have the entrance reduced all season, and have positive results.
To bad we couldn't just follow one plan and have it work every time.


Take care

[Alex Cantacuzene]

Hi, this morning the temps in mid-Kentucky are in the forties. One of our hives was very small when given to us late summer and they were in a card-board box. They started with us in a medium and 2:1 feed. They expanded rapidly and are now, a month later, filling two mediums. The feeding is being done with quart jars sitting over the "oval" hole in the center of an Arheit inner cover that I heightened to five inches. (Thanks Tim Arheit!) To clear the jars we have an empty medium above, then the normal inner cover and then the telescoping cover. It all works great and we will do the same arrangement with the other hives some time later. However, this morning, with the temperature change, there was condensation on top of the standard inner cover which means to me that it will be repeated through the cold season and will keep the girls dry below. At the end of feeding time I plan to remove the extra empty top medium, line the the Arheit inner cover with insulation, including the sides, and leave just a small opening for ventilation. Of course all this is from a hobbyist and we will see how it works in the spring. In any case, I am convinced that the normal inner cover is an important part of a hive, will check moisture and prevents the girls from propolising the telescoping cover. Just my 2 cents, or a bit more? Take care and have fun.

[Michael Bush]

When I make inner covers I drill a hole with a hole saw the size of a mason jar lid so I can feed through it. Then I put #8 hardware cloth under it so I can pull the feeder without fighting with the bees.