retrieving bees from floor

[panthercreekbees]

Can you use a shop vac to vacuum the bees and not kill them?

I have a colony in between floor joists and am considering using that to get the bees and then get the comb.

[iddee]

A shop vac will kill them. You have to have a middle container and a way to control vac pressure.

Here is an example.

http://s81.photobucket.com/albums/j226/Iddee/BEE%20VAC/

[Putz]

The shop vac will kill them, the hose has ridges and the vacuum is too strong, they'll be mush by the time they get into the canister.

[Troy]

I made a bee vac sort of like iddee's in the previous link. I have used it to vacuum bees out of a floor joist situation and had very few dead bees.

Just do a search and make one. A bee vac just allows the bees to come to a gentle stop in a screened box, and allows you to control the air flow velocity so that the bee roll gently down the pipe.

[Putz]

I've often thought I might try modifying a shop vac to be a bee vac, but have not done so. My thoughts were to

#1 replace the hose and get extension of smooth hoses.

#2, make a hole in the top of the vac with a sliding flap cover so I could modify the vacuum strength. Maybe try drilling a 2" hole in top and use cut out the bottom of a tin can, leave it round with a tab. bend the tab up as a handle. poprivitt it to the top of the vac so you could slide it using the tab to open or close off the hole reducing vac strength. screen in the hole of course.

The vac motors are covered with a foam filter so would cushion the bees as they came up against it. The possible prob I forsee is that in not having an inner screen box, the bees will be sucked up against the foam filter around the vac motor, don't know how they'd fare with that.

[JaiPea]

Ray is right on with smooth hose (2 1/2" dust collection) and some kind of pressure control. Whatever method is used to adjust pressure, it has to be screened to prevent bees escaping.

Bees being pulled in need deceleration space, the longer the deceleration space the more bees that live.

On most shop vacs, the foam filter is in the center, and slap bang in the middle of the deceleration path. The foam may help a little, but nowhere near enough.

The best bee vacs have a long (>12") and uninterrupted deceleration path, with suction to the side of the deceleration path.

If you must use the shop vac, remove the foam filter and screen/foam the intake so that the bees have the whole diameter of the base to slow down in. If you have the pressure reduced properly, there will not be enough suction flow in the base to pull them up to the intake and they will collect on the bottom. It is the concentration of flow in the intake and hose that creates the suction, it is surprisingly low 2-3" away from the intake.

[panthercreekbees]

Thanks guys for the info. I liked the idea of using the super for the deceleration space and it gets the bees where you want them also.:):)

[Troy]

Has anybody out there got one of the dust cyclones in their woodshop? I've thought that the ultimate vac would be based on that concept.

The concept is that you vacuum up dust and woodchips into a tornado shaped funnel. As the dust goes round and round everything is flung to the middle and just drops out of the tornado. The key thing is that there would be no impact at all. The one downside I can see is that the bees will be REALLY dizzy.

Do bees get dizzy? Will this harm them more or less than the impact? Questions only, no answers........

[JaiPea]

Panther, glad you decided to go the super route because there are more things to consider if you modify a shop vac.

When you stop the vac, bees will climb up the walls and cluster on the top, blocking the screen/foam so every time you restart you will have to thump the vac to knock them down.

The likelihood of the bees dying is high with any sizable removal, as it is all too easy to pull them in alive but kill them all by leaving them penned for too long. They will be fine as long as there is air being drawn through but frantic bees generate a lot of heat and that will do them in.

Troy, having seen the size of cyclones in a friend's workshop I can't imagine how to reduce it far enough to carry to a job. As for getting dizzy, sounds like an experiment in the making.

[papa bear]

hey. i seem to remember some of the old electrolux vacuum had smooth hoses. i bet most of the well made older models were all made like that

[Eaglerock]

hey. i seem to remember some of the old electrolux vacuum had smooth hoses. i bet most of the well made older models were all made like that

I wonder if you can still buy smooth hoses.

[panthercreekbees]

I fastened a shop vac to the super like the pictures showed in earlier post.

It worked great!!! The bees did not even get real worked up. I used a 1" inside dia smooth hose and put a nylon in front of the shop vac so they would not get in there. The only thing that could have worked better is if I had made a larger screen for the vac as it kept getting bees in fromt of it and I would have to shut it off so they could get freed up. I will see soon how I did as far as mortality but they look good so far.

Thanks Again

[Troy]

panthercreek,

Where did you find smooth hose? I know others have mentioned pool cleaner hose, but I'm looking for alternatives as i wasn't thrilled with the flexibility of the pool hose.

[panthercreekbees]

I could get all kinds of different hoses with smooth insides at my local implement dealer. They have all kinds of hose for spray riggs for agriculture.

The one thing I would do different is I would make a larger screened area so the bees could not congregate at the shop vac intake.

It seems that it worked the bees are working at cleaning the comb I put in the frames from what they had in the floor and are flying out for resources.

I did see some sort of dragonfly attack and kill a bee coming into the hive, I am not sure what kind it was but I saw it happen twice in five minutes or so.

[iddee]

Congrats on a job well done. If you will look at the photos again, you will see that the super has a screen separating it into two compartments. It is slanted to cause the bees to hit at an angle of less than 90 degrees. They do not get near the vacuum hole.

[Hobie]

I wonder if you can still buy smooth hoses.

Marine and rv sanitation hose is smooth on the inside, for obvious reasons. Don't know how the diameters compare to shop vac hose, though.