Hive Beetle Treatments

[Joel]

After reading the recent thread on ABJ's beetle traps and the yeast information I'm curious to see how much of a problem we are having with beetles and how folks are dealing with them.

We consider beetles a minor problem, at this point, due to our cycle north and south. I've purchased the soil drench but never used it. We've used cumophos stapled to cardboard on the bottom board of which the bees quickly dispatched the cardboard. I can't honestly say the strips are effective or we are just one step ahead of the breeding due to moving hives north b-4 warm weather or the clay soil we have in NY. We did loose one hive to them in short order after putting a bottom pollen trap on with the pollen screen in upside down. The beetles destroyed the hive and we burned it.

What's everone else doing and seeing?

[Beaches' Bee-Haven Apiary]

I can't honestly say the strips are effective or we are just one step ahead of the breeding due to moving hives north b-4 warm weather or the clay soil we have in NY.

The Pres. of my club took his hives up into the Appalachians in NC and said that all the SHB abandoned the hive (temp. or altitude maybe?)



What's everone else doing and seeing?

I'm at a state where I'm just living with them, but trying to keep them in check. I used the ground drench some, but I hate working with dangerous chemicals. And I've tried the sandwich traps, but don't think I made them right. I'm going to Dadant.com right now to order some Beetle Eaters... I wish that yeast were one the market.

-Nathanael:cool:

[Panhandle Bee man]

Here's my take on shb, Here in Florida the worst months for shb are June thru Sept. That is when we see the worse damage/take down of hives. That is also when we get the highest heat and humidity. Other issues at that time of year, are high varroa mite counts, declining bee numbers in the hives, and lack of major nectar/pollen flows. Some things that help reduce shb issues are, give the hives only enough space so that the bees can defend that space, keep hives in sunlight (as Lawrence Cutts has been known to say, shade only helps the beekeeper), mini mating nucs don't have the bees to survive shb, shb traps, use caution when splitting hives in the summer (use more bees/less frames), be cautious when using pollen suppliment patties. When using pollen traps empty and freeze the pollen on a frequent basis (daily if possible). Moving hives seems to agitate the shb, and cause them to abandon hives. Coumaphos will kill shb, however, traps IMO kill more shb. I just got an email from the Mite Gone formic acid people, and their tests show that when using formic acid, shb leave for up to 5 weeks, expect an ABJ article in April on the tests. Essential oils that seem to work repeling shb are thymol, and tea tree oil. I know several migratory beekeepers that treat their hives with those essential oils just prior to moving their hives northward and by the time they get to their summer honey yards they report that they have few shb left in their hives. As I keep my hives here in florida year round, I first see a spike in shb numbers when they move out, then later in July is when I start to see even larger numbers. Ground drenches seem to be a waste of time. From my research, it seems that you would have to drench a large area to be successful, and then have to repeat it frequently. Also given the large area that shb fly, you can still find a large number of adult shb that are being raised by other beekeepers, or at feral hives. So you really haven't done anything to stop shb at your hives.

Joel, I believe that you are picking up the majority of your shb during your winter trips down south. I am familiar with Chemung/Tioga counties as I grew up there, and the weather there is not conducive to raising large populations of shb. Too cold/dry the majority of the year. I have given some thought on keeping bees there, and from my experience, using a fall treatment of formic acid, and overwintering hives there would get rid of over 90% of the shb in your hives in the first year.

[tecumseh]

beaches writes:
The Pres. of my club took his hives up into the Appalachians in NC and said that all the SHB abandoned the hive (temp. or altitude maybe?)

tecumseh writes:
the shb is not suppose to tolerate low humidity (which also should limit the growth of mold and yeast which seem to be the largest attractant for the shb).

the shb can be a real problem here in regards to new starts and weak hives. another good reason for doing splits as early as possible.

I notice more problems in hives where either the construction technique of the box (me bad!) is poor or the material is deterioriating. the more hiding places you allow the larger the problem you encourage. I have seen shb hide in those sunken portion of plastic frames plus in the groove of split bottom bars in wood frames. I now only purchase frames with solid bottom bars for this reason alone. In the recent past I have noticed several hives lost via shb infestation that I suspect began as a minor problem in the bottom box when the shb got a foot hold in those little groves in split bottom bars.

[Dale Hodges]

SHB hate light, hate the hive being moved, hate the hive being disturbed. I keep extra bottoms and supers with me when I visit the yards. If I see a hive that seems to have too many( 20-25) I move the colony onto new bottom and new super one frame at a time.(killing every SHB I can). If the pest have gotten into frames lightly, I use the water hose on them. If thier really bad they go into solar melter. I read several places that disturbing the hive lets the SHB take over, this just has not been my experence, exposing them to light makes them leave. I've also been going over my woodware with a glue bottle, filling every crack and crevice I can find.

[tecumseh]

mr hodges writes:
I've also been going over my woodware with a glue bottle, filling every crack and crevice I can find.


tecumseh writes:
yep... same here. on hives with problems (typically newer splits) i have found feeding, boosting (add a frame of mature brood) and freezing highly infected frames helps greatly.

and last, of course, is the sharp edge of my hive tool.

[Bizzybee]

Moving the hives north will definitely rid them of shb to a huge degree. They do not tolerate cold anymore than the bees do. And they don't have the advantage of a cluster as the bees do. But most hives will allow a few to stay in the cluster with them.

When brood rearing begins they will run them out of the hive. From there they do what they do to get their numbers back up, hence later in the season you will see the numbers increase to the point of possibly being a threat.

[beemandan]

We started 80 new hives late last summer. A bad time to try to start hives. 40 were moved to Perry, Ga (just south of Macon) to draw comb on cotton nectar and 40 were moved to Blairsville, Ga (in the mountains) to draw comb on sourwood blooms. All were returned to the Athens, GA area to overwinter. 15 of the Perry colonies survived. 38 of the Blairsville colonies made it. The main culprit in the Perry bunch? SHB. The two sites are about 200 miles apart, as the bee flies. Across that span SHB go from being a serious pest to only a nuisance.
So, in my opinion, where you keep your bees will surely determine the severity of the SHB infestation. Here in Athens they are a problem but manageable. South of Macon? I don't know how anybody can keep bees.

[Bizzybee]

I'll have to agree with you there beeman, I don't envy them a bit. It was nice this past year not having to deal with them for the first part of the year after that cold snap we had. But the hot long season that followed allowed them to catch back up. I saw more towards the end of the season than I have in the past. I got into the hives not to long ago in one of our warmer spells and found a fair number of them in some of the clusters. Far more than last year. But we've had a couple of pretty good freezes since, including tonite with 19 degrees here. I was afraid we weren't going to get any temps in the teens this year.

I hope it's been enough to push em back some more. They don't deal with the cold well. Not even in the clusters if it's cold enough. They don't deal with it well at all, maybe their origins in South Africa I would imagine.

I certainly don't see them being the problem in the north that they are in the deep south. But like we've both said before, they are more of a nuisance like the moth than anything else. Loosing a hive to them isn't all that horrific. I see it as a natural selection, but I would rather find the problem first and requeen than have a total loss.

With the complete disregard for nature and transportation of non indigenous species from continent to continent. I suspect we haven't seen our last problem. Who knows, maybe we'll get lucky and one will show up that likes bees and eats vorroa' and shb.

It could happen!! :D

[Joel]

Dan, that's a pretty significant difference. Is there a major altitude difference between the two locations or other charactaristics you would contribute this to (Soil, shade, temp?). Had you treated for beetles? Is the sourwood location more isolated from neighboring beeks?

The initial SHB maps showed a definite trail along I-95, the main east coast transport for bees. Curios with all the pollination headed west we don't hear more from Ca. and the west?

[Bizzybee]

There would be little or no difference in soil, the same ole red clay. A difference of about 1200 to 1400 feet in elevation. The big difference is temperature. The mountains will see temps below 0 and many days in the single digits. Where we see the occasional mid teens and below Macon even rarer occasions of teens.

Dan treat? Never!!

[beemandan]

Dan treat? Never!!

Well, at least hardly ever. None of the colonies from Perry or Blairsville were 'treated' for SHB in any conventional sense. I think I've gotta leave it at that.

[tecumseh]

joel writes:
The initial SHB maps showed a definite trail along I-95, the main east coast transport for bees. Curios with all the pollination headed west we don't hear more from Ca. and the west?

tecumseh replies:
i have been informed that california has them but that the entry station are quite serious about keeping large numbers from coming in hitching a ride on a bee truck. I know at least one fellow here (I assume others did the same) that installed those 'pest strips' on the bottom board since some 'authority' suggested that would make entry easier.

in regards to beemandan description I would be curious as to the difference in the two locations in regards to insecticide use. which is to suggest that when I hear of someone plopping hives down on cotton (at least here) you can almost be assured of some loss from insecticide kills. even an insecticide spray that would weaken a hive would likely set that hive up to be quickly over run with shb.

[beemandan]

in regards to beemandan description I would be curious as to the difference in the two locations in regards to insecticide use. which is to suggest that when I hear of someone plopping hives down on cotton (at least here) you can almost be assured of some loss from insecticide kills. even an insecticide spray that would weaken a hive would likely set that hive up to be quickly over run with shb.

Most of the cotton planted in S GA is now the genetically modified varieties. From what I've been told, the only spraying done on those fields (the ones where our bees were 'plopped down') were growth retardants. We weren't told that until after the fact. So, pesticides could surely be a factor.

I can tell you, on personal observation, that established colonies in the Athens, GA area (about mid-way between Perry and Blairsville) typically have substantially higher infestations than those in the N GA mountains. And ag pesticides aren't a factor here. So, I'm pretty confident that climatic differences were a factor as well.

[Bizzybee]

I've got em as far south as Sparta, about 50 miles south as the crow flies from here (no bees don't fly that far :) ). Another 50 south to Perry from there.

No ag crops anywhere around that yard for many years. But I don't see any significant difference between them and the hives kept here. Has turned out to be a great yard so far, I plan to expand it some this year and also picked up a couple more along the way between here and there.

Guess I may be a gluten for punishment, but there's only one way to find out.

[GaSteve]

>when I hear of someone plopping hives down on cotton (at least here) you can almost be assured of some loss from insecticide kills. even an insecticide spray that would weaken a hive would likely set that hive up to be quickly over run with shb.

I totally agree with that. I'm only about 20 miles north of Perry and I have never lost healthy hives to SHB. They have destroyed a hive that was very weak due to being queenless (I only have 15 hives). I may eventually be proven wrong, but I still consider SHB to be a secondary pest like waxmoths.

I refuse to put hives on cotton -- summer flow or not. It's not worth it. I would rather feed. Ditto for peaches.

I know about those "unconventional" SHB treatments. They are also very toxic to bees if you're not careful.

[Bizzybee]

I suppose I would give em one up on the moths only because they are ever present and on hand if the opportunity presents itself. More so than the moths. With that in mind, I use about the same approach as I would with the moths. They were far more fierce at the end of this past year than the beetles. Even though I saw some ridiculous numbers of beetles in a few hives. The first cold weather did the beetles in before the moths were affected as bad.