What gauge brad nailer do you use ?

[woodchopper]

My wife bought me a electric 18 gauge brad nailer to help me when I'm assembling frames. Anyone here think the 18 gauge brads will be to wide and split the wood frames? Looks like it'll work fine but if I have to I'll get one that'll use thinner brads. Thanks.

[BjornBee]

18ga is fine. I glue and use 18ga 1-1/4 inch brad nails. Never had a problem. I also use 5/8 inch for the wedge.

They don't split the wood at all.

[woodchopper]

Thank you kindly for the info and quick response.

[Ross]

what he said.

[carbide]

What they said.

[BjornBee]

What we said. ;)

[Joel]

YEP :cool: Stressing Glue!

[ January 16, 2007, 09:28 PM: Message edited by: Joel ]

[Lively Bee's]

I use a air powered staple gun on the wedge and a 18ga finish nailer to put the frames together

[sierrabees]

What kind of electric stapler do you have that takes long enough brads to do the job? I have only found electric ones that take brads less than one inch long. I prefer not to have to drag an air compressor around to where I want to work, but the air nailers seem to best fit the job.

[woodchopper]

Ann bought me a "Task Force" from the local Lowe's. The two longest brads are 1-3/16th and 1-1/4" in length. A woman in our bee club has one{not sure of the brand} and it won't drive the long brads all the way home. I'll try it within the next day with the long brads and let you know how it does. #AC120V and #221500 are the Lowes part numbers on the package if you want to look it up.

[peggjam]

I have a craftsmen that drives 1 1/4" brads fine. Bought it used off ebay. Alot easier than a hammer. I was wondering if staples wouldn't work better though?

[Ross]

If you don't want to drag a compressor, pickup a used SCUBA tank and an old regulator. The intermediate pressure side is usually around 135 PSI. You can adapt an air chuck fitting. A 3000 PSI fill will last a long time driving 1 1/4 inch brads.

[ January 17, 2007, 11:48 AM: Message edited by: Ross ]

[flathead]

I use a 1/4" crown by 1" long staple(galvanized) driven with an air stapler from HomeDepot.

Two through the top bar, one in the bottom bar and one in from the end bar into the top bar when assembling frames. I switch to 1/2" long staples in the same stapler when installing foundation (wedges).

I will look at the staple gauge when I am in my shop next but think it is 18Ga.

No splitting problems.

[Dave W]

If you don't want to drag a compressor . . .

You could use your vehicle's AC pump (w/o Freon) to fill an empty BBQ grill tank.

Don’t laugh! It’s been done smile.gif


Ross . . .

Is it the 3000 PSI or volume that’s important in driving a lot of brads?

[jamiev]

which gun size and nail/brad size would you recommend for nailing hive bodies together, or does it make more sense to just hand nail? Would staples work both frames and hive bodies??? Trying to save $ too

[Michael Bush]

I have a 1/4" wide crown stapler. I buy 1" long staples for frames. I buy 1 1/2" long staples for nailing boxes. I buy 5/8" long staples for nailing shims onto my lids to make the top entrances. I buy 1/2" long staples to nail the 1/4" luan onto 5/16" strips to make my top feeder/inner covers or to nail on the 1/8" hardware cloth on bottom boards. I buy 1 1/4" long staples for nailing a 3/4" board onto a 3/4" board without it sticking out (like nailing in the middle of cleats for handles).

[drobbins]

Michael

what is a "crown stapler"?
I've seem many references to them here
does it shoot what I think of as a "staple"
a U shaped piece of wire?
what does "crown" mean?
is that the distance between the 2 wires?
I did some google searches and found pics of what look like little nails guns, but I can't see any detail
I'm not a woodworker, I have a machinist background

Dave

[Michael Bush]

>what is a "crown stapler"?

The staple has a "crown" to it. The top is not exactly flat, but rounded.

>I've seem many references to them here
does it shoot what I think of as a "staple"
a U shaped piece of wire?

Yes.

>what does "crown" mean?

It's rounded on the top.

>is that the distance between the 2 wires?

The 1/4" is the width of the staple. Outside to outside it's slightly less than 1/4"

[jamiev]

So the crown stapler covers all or at least most of your beekeeper needs. I like that. I assume this is a pneumatic stapler, not electric? What size compressor? thanks for your help MB and drobbins your followup ?s were also helpful

[fat/beeman]

you can get by useing 1/4 crown staple. I like useing several sizes of brads and staples/ on hive bodys I use the 1/2 x1 1/2 lengh seems to hold lot better no need for glue.
frames 1/4x1 and 1/4 long enough on the wedge I use 5/8 brads so they can be pulled out and reused
If you want to use 1/4 on hive bodys you need to glue for sure as staples will back out in time.
you can buy on harbour frieght.com there about 20.00 staplers for 39.00
Don :D

[BerkeyDavid]

I use the crown stapler too. yes the nice thing is the different ranges it takes. Here is a good one - uses a range from 3/8" to 1 1/2".

Nice thing about the crown staple is you have 2 metal pins rather than a single nail, connected at the top by the "crown".

Grizzly 18 ga. crown stapler - $29.95 (http://www.grizzly.com/products/h7678)

I have a different one but basically the same.

[carbide]

When putting frames together I use two brad nailers. I have one set up with 18 ga. x 1-1/4" long brads that I use to nail the top bar to the end bars and the end bars to the bottom bars (divided bottom bars). I have the other stapler set up with 18 ga. x 5/8" brads to fasten in the wedge bar for the foundation. This way I don't have to bother changing different size brads back and forth.

I also use the 1-1/4" brads to tack my hive bodies together once I glue them. These hold the boxes aligned together until I get the 1-1/4" drywall screws all run in.

[woodchopper]

Carbide, 1-1/4 drywall screws? What a novel idea. Bet they hold better than the nails do. Seems like everybody here uses air nailers and not electric ones. Hope I don't have problems down the road.

[Ishi]

I use 2" drywall screws 1 5/8 if I am out of 2". If you break out the rabbit on the top of the super just take out enough screws to clear the saw, cut off the top 1 1/2 " and make a new pice.

[Michael Bush]

The deck screws are the best. I just don't always have time to mess with them. They work best with a pilot hole and drilling all the pilot holes and then screwing in all the screws is a lot of work. But it pays off. I prefer 2" for the corners but at least 1 1/2". I like the 1 1/4" for putting cleats on (except the corners) where you don't want the screw to stick out when putting it through two 3/4" boards.

[BerkeyDavid]

I use an air nailer. But if I was going to get into the screwing game I would look at the power screwdrivers the deck builders use.

Senco Automatic Feed Screwdriver (http://www.amazon.com/Senco-1P0001N-DS300-AC-Duraspin-Screwdriver/dp/B0000DYVRE/ref=pd_sbs_hi_2/102-6873692-7997715)

Great excuse for a new tool!

[carbide]

[QUOTE] Great excuse for a new tool!

Judging from your past comments, it didn't appear that you needed any excuse. :D

[Brent Bean]

I split frames trying to nail them together on a regular basis, I rarely do using an 18 gauge brad nailer they are a great thing for beekeeping probably rate right up there with the movable frame bee hive. ;)

[George Fergusson]

>I split frames trying to nail them together on a regular basis

Wrong wood, or wrong technology for the available wood. If the nailer works, I suppose you're all set. I'll get a crown stapler when I run out of 1.25" wire nails, in about 5 years smile.gif

[drobbins]

the nice thing about a brad nailer is it sinks the head so you don't see it
of course this doesn't much matter in a beehive
I can easily see how a staple is stronger which is what we're after
they're pretty cheap, I see one in my future smile.gif

Dave

[Ishi]

David

I have a drywall screw gun 2500rpm it will twist off a #6 screw down in the wood then the tops will warp.

[George Fergusson]

>the nice thing about a brad nailer is it sinks the head so you don't see it

Oh! Those unsightly nail heads!

[John F]

If you use glue, and you should, and you do it right so you don't have a glue starved joint, then the difference between a stapler and a brad nailer is nil. You are only using them to hold the frame together until the glue sets.

In the woodworking world, brads aren't used except in places where you are tacking things in place as they are consider to have no strength so when the joint strength comes from a fastener the woodworker will use at least a fastener of the finish nail size. I do not know the area of contact of the staples but suspect that it comes close to the that of a finish nail and if you were only using fasteners then it no doubt beats a brad.

But a good glue joint makes either unnecessary.

Now the joint most likey to go bad on these is the joint between the sides and the top as it includes a fair amount of end grain. (bottom of dado on end bars and shoulders on top bars) You should butter the end bar end grain and let it sit for a bit then add glue again when assembling.

Mine, from Kelly's, are tight enough that they don't need a clamp. Here is how I do it:

.Hold the end bars so that I can butter the end grain.
.stick the endbars in the jig upside down and glue the bottom bars on.
.flip the jig over.
.Put glue on the topbars and pop them on.

Sometime I assemble 10 while I really doing something else so I just leave them in the jig until the glue sets. For these I'm done. Othertimes I will be assembling a bunch so I have to move them out of the jig wet. For those I drive a brad down into the end bar from above so they will stay together while I jostle them around.

This is with titebond II. If you use gorilla glue (or any PU glue) then you must somehow maintain clamping pressure or the glue will foam your work apart.

[woodchopper]

Ann and I ended up taking the "Task Force" brad nailer back to Lowe's today because it didn't have enough power to drive the brads home. We ended up buying a Hitachi 2" pneumatic that should have more than enough power. It'll also take the smaller 5/8" brads that we can use for installing foundation. Between the new air gun and the jig I bought the 350 frames I have to do will go alot quicker and smoother. Thanks for the input everybody.