grafting tools

[eaglesbee]

HI
i have had a few tell me on this forum that a grafting tool can be made from a paperclip does anyone have a Picture of one that i can see?
or any other ideas
eaglesbee

[Chef Isaac]

I would just break down and buy a chinese grafting tool. they are awesome.

[Bob Russell]

eaglebee
I did form one from electric fence wire some years ago and it worked very well.Very important to round off edges sand and polish so it will not damage the lava.These days I use a treble zero (000) sable hair artist brush.These are also available in synthetic bristle but a little harsh.You can become very skillful with a brush,once you get the knack it is so easy.Just roll the bristle under from the back of the "c" shape of the lava lift out and just roll off in reverse into the cell cup being carefull not to roll the lava.You only pick the lava up on the very edge.If you have trouble seeing and lifting the lava just cut down one side of your cell with knife or sharp hive tool to expose the lava for better access.The bees will readily repair the cell.

[george dilley]

http://www.dave-cushman.net/bee/graftingtools.html

[tarheit]

Interesting. I tried the chinese grafting tool and hated it. The tougue always seemd to catch on the cell and curl the wrong way. I like the german stainless tool myself.

-Tim

[eaglesbee]

Thanks For the Help everyone

[D. Murrell]

[ April 11, 2006, 10:05 PM: Message edited by: B Wrangler ]

[D. Murrell]

Hi Guys,

Concerning the Chinese tool, sometimes the tip is too stiff. Take a little 400 grit sandpaper and thin the very end of the tip out. Then round the tip edges a little.

When the tool is slide down the sidewall, it should follow the sidewall down and end up under the royal jelly beneath the larva. Twist the tool very slightly, between the thumb and forefinger(it's more of a feel than a rotation) and withdrawn the tool, back up the sidewall, with the larva.

The tool will have a different feel when used with newly drawn comb or with comb on a new plastic foundation base. The tool will tend to stick when it reaches the cell bottom rather than curving and following the bottom of the cell beneath the larva, as it does on older comb. A stiff Chinese tool is almost impossible to use in this circumstance. It must be thinned and tappered if you graft off of this kind of comb.

When thinning the tip, keep a taper to the thickness, just make it thinner. And go easy. Thin it a little. Test it. And stop when it works for you. The tip can be made too thin. If that happens , sand or trim the tip back, a little and try again.

An advantage to the Chinese tool, is that the larve themselves aren't handled. They are scooped up with the royal jelly and deposited the same way without ever being 'touched'.

When placing them in a cup, the larva on the tip of the tool are positioned in the center of the cup by sliding the tool down the cell wall. Then, rather than pushing them off with the extractor part of the tool, the tool is slide back up the sidewall, while the extractor is pushed to keep the larva centered in the cup. It's sounds hard and slow, but it's fast and very easy to do in practice.

Regards
Dennis

[ April 11, 2006, 10:07 PM: Message edited by: B Wrangler ]

[Michael Bush]

Buy several of the chinese tools. They vary in quality. You'll like some better than others.

[Chef Isaac]

Michael: Do you mean from the same supplier? I got my from Davids place in Canada (cant think of the name). Good tool!

[loggermike]

>Buy several of the chinese tools. They vary in quality. You'll like some better than others.

I noticed that.They are cheap enough that I always have a handful so if one doesnt feel right I grab another.Thanks for the modification tips Dennis.

[Michael Bush]

Yes, from the same supplier. They are nice but the quality control is not consistent. They are cheap enough you can pick through for one you like.

I have noticed the old timers always prefer their stainless steel ones and the beginners always prefer the Chinese one.

[loggermike]

I used the so called automatic needle for many years just because it scooped up the bed of jelly with the larvae.But the metal tongues were always kinking if too much wax built up.I dont know if they are even made anymore.The Chinese tool seemed like a low tech version of the same thing and has proved to be very good.I heard Addees do all their grafting with them too.I NEVER liked the metal grafting needles.I made my first graft more than 30 years ago.

[Nick Noyes]

I like the chinese tool. We have some of those automatic grafting tools I can't make them work they are slow. Buy about 10 of the chinese tools and pick the better ones out and throw the rest away. Really no different than anything else made in china.

[loggermike]

Oh , so you've been to Harbor Freight too!Chinese factories send everything they make out the door-no quality control, just cheap cheap cheap.

[ April 16, 2006, 12:04 PM: Message edited by: loggermike ]

[TwT]

Loggermike, that aoutmatic tool is that the Automatic Grafting Tool that kelly sale's, how did you like it and do you still use it?

[loggermike]

I liked them ok till I tried the Chinese tool.Much faster.I still have a couple around for backup but can't remember the last time I actually used one so its been a few years.Like M.B. and Nick said, at 3 bucks each you can buy a handful of Chinese tools and pick out the best ones.I would'nt buy the auto tool now.

[D. Murrell]

Hi Guys,

The original Chinese grafting tool was a food grade, hard plastic affair. The only organic part was the tip. I obtained these in Europe over a decade ago. Other than tip stiffness, they were almost perfect and I never wore one of these out while grafting tens of thousands of larva.

The new ones have a wooden shaft and are much cheaper. Moisture can cause the wooden shaft to swell and become sticky. When using this kind for commercial grafting, I had several available and switch between them during the day. Unfortunately, these kind don't stand up to commercial grafting. I've had to replace them every year. Fortunately, they are very inexpensive.

I've used the automatic grafting tool as well. The tips are formed from a watch case spring. I don't know whether these are even available for watches, let alone the grafting tool. I had a few spares, but they bend easily and am down to a single one. I haven't used this tool in ten years.

This tool worked great, but not as good as the Chinese tool. With this tool, the larva still had to be seen and the tool manuvered to get underneath them. With the Chinese tool and the right aged larva, the larva don't even really have to be seen to be grafted. It's more of a quick look for the right kind of royal jelly. And then the larva are grafted, more by the sense of touch and tool methodology, than by sight. And that difference makes the Chinese tool very fast.

I've still got a few of those first Chinese tools that haven't been used. Maybe one these could be used as the basis for a stainless steel model made in the USA :>)))

Regards
Dennis

[nursebee]

Thanks for the excellent description B Wrangler! I also use the Chinese tool, but only 3 times so far. No real problems out of the box. But I also destroy the adjoining comb so it is easy to slide under.

[tecumseh]

I have used the automatic grafting tool from kelleys for years. the trick to reducing the number of tongues that fail is to loosen the screw that hold the tongue to the handle after you have finished grafting. I have always suspected oxidation created by moisture as the main culprit.

[loggermike]

I figured that a buildup of hard wax inside the tube was the main cause of the tongues kinking.This would happen the first time it was used after being stored.So I would clean the tube and tongue in boiling water before use.
As for the feel of the chinese tool I once in a pinch grafted in poor light without my glasses(basically couldnt see a thing!) and still got a good take of cells.