View Full Version : whats the advantage of a 3 frame nuc
06-13-2004, 05:57 PM
At present Im using using nuc's for breeding that are 2 frames (deep) and a feeder and the mating is ok but Im wondering if maybe I should change to 3 frames to allow more laying room.I try to transfer the nucs to a normal hive as soon as I can but the queen fills up the 2 frames pretty fast.
06-13-2004, 08:57 PM
It depends on what your goal is. The mini mating nucs are very popular because they only require a cupful of bees. I like to use standard frames, myself, so I have some two frame medium depth mating nucs. I also have a three, about four four frames and a lot of five frame. If you want to start a nuc, I'd go for the five frame (but I have medium frames, so it's less room actually).
If all you want to do is mate a queen and see if she's laying to put her somewhere else, then two frames is fine.
Scot Mc Pherson
06-22-2004, 07:05 AM
There are several reasons for using small nucs to raise and mate queens. THe first reason being obvious is that the number of donated brood combs is less, leaving more brood combs for either more mating nucs or left for production hives.
The 2nd reason which may not be so obvious is competition. The larger nucs will gather more nectar and pollen increasing competition for food sources. If your beeyard is very large, then reducing competition might be a good thing.
CC Miller, although didn't talk much at all about rasing queens did mention and discuss competition in a sideline manner. He said at his yards his bees did best when he had about 100 full strength hives at a single location. Not a per hive best, but a per yard best. He also mentioned, though I think through speculation, that in his area 56 the most bee hives to have in his yards without any competition for food between the hives. He worded everything differently, but this is the root of what he conveyed.
Scot Mc Pherson
Foundationless Small Cell Top Bar Hives
BeeWiki: <A HREF="http://linuxfromscratch.org/~scot/beewiki/" TARGET=_blank>
06-22-2004, 08:47 AM
I've tried just about every combination of sizes for mating except for mini-nucs. I settled on five deep frame nucs. They are completely self sufficient and can be overwintered in the north.
Kirk Webster has pioneered a method that works great for northern honey/queen producers. His method utilizes standard equipment. He published a series of articles starting in the Feb 1997 Bee Journal. It's a must read for any northern honey/queen producer.
06-22-2004, 10:30 AM
Afraid I don't have them. I'd love to read the articles.
Any idea where to find them?
06-22-2004, 11:46 PM
Cornell University, industry associations and hardworking beekeepers have partnered to put rare bee books on the Web. The first ten volumes of 90 selected candidates from the E. F. Phillips rare beekeeping book collection are now available and fully searchable http://bees.library.cornell.edu
06-23-2004, 05:21 AM
Thanks! I found that link once and lost it and wasn't having any luck finding it again.
06-23-2004, 04:21 PM
my own twist on the concept is to use a single deep body and place however many frames in it for the nuc as i need at the time....sometimes it is 2, 3, 4 or 5. depends on time of year, what i have to donate bees and brood, etc.
then you have a bunch of empty space in the deep that you can fill with foundation to let them draw or more importantly for me you have empty space to put combs from those nucs that failed. if you are only doing a couple of mating nucs it might not be an issue but if you are doing many you will always have something that is junk.
secondly, you then dont have to do the transferring of the newly laying nuc to a body. i think the transfer produces too high of supercedure rates.
and your nucs will build up faster as those additional combs, bees and brood are added. which puts them in a single going into the winter instead of the nuc. which may or may not be an advantage compared to a nuc for overwintering but it will be an advantage come spring if you need early bees.
06-23-2004, 05:35 PM
hey guys where can i find the articals by Kirk Webster?