Results to expect from Oxalic Acid Treatment

[Patrick Scannell]

If you have successfully used OA to treat Varroa Mites, please share what you saw on the SBB post treatment.

I have one strong hive with an exploding mite population. After a summer of FMGO fogging, and a few mites per day dropping, I suddenly noticed hundreds of mites dropping per day, and DWV bees crawling out the entrance.

I treated with OA using the propane heated "crack pipe" method, and have noticed no significant difference in mite drop.

My question is: does OA kill rapidly, so I should expect to see a huge mite drop the next day, and then few afterwords? Or does the OA kill by distroying the mites mouths,
so I should expect to see a gradual increase in mite drop as the mites starve over a period of days?

[Michael Bush]

I was getting about 4 to 6 mites a day natural drop when I treated and there was no brood in the hive. The drop was over a period of a week or soand then I repeated the treatment and totaled about 200 mites per hive after two weeks. Not very many the second week.

[Dave W]

Greetings Patrick,

I used OC on 10/1/04 and have posted pre-treatment "drops" on Forum1,HTML,001304. Check it out!!

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Dave W . . .

Hobbyist - 1 Hive
First Package - Apr 03
Broodnest - 3 Deeps
Screened Bottom Board
Apistan - Aug 18, 03
Grease Patties - All year
2003/04 Winter Loss - 0%
See Forum1/HTML/001304, for ongoing mite counts.

[wishthecuttlefish]

I am getting similar results as Michael Bush. Specifically:

Red Hive: < 2 natural mite drop per day. Left untreated.

Blue Hive: Approx. 25 natural mite drop per day. Treated from top with OA. About 500 mites dropping over the course of a week. Second treatment from bottom. About 100 mites dropping over the course of a week.

I will continue checking to see if a third treatment on blue hive is warranted.

Some interesting thing to note between my two hives:
Red hive, which has very few mites went queenless in July-August for 30 days until they raised a new one from eggs. These were originally Italians from a package started in April.

Blue hive was also originally Italian started from package in April. Requeened with Carni in August.

Kai

[Patrick Scannell]

Thanks for your comments.

Four days after OA treatment the number of mites dropping is down to about 100/day. I'll retreat after a week. I also switched from straight FGMO to 5% thymol and will continue that weekly.

[wishthecuttlefish]

Patrick,
If you are using OA, I just do not see the value of using FGMO/Thymol.

Using any type of invasive treatment such as fogging or OA vapor is going to be stressful on the bees. Doing both, weekly, is going to be very disruptive.

In my opinion, drop the FGMO (its effectiveness is controversial and arguable at best). Just do the OA treatments.

[ox]

I was only noticeing a very few mites dropping from the hives before treatment. There were a few deformed winged bees in one of the hives. Plenty of open larva cells in the hives. Pollen and nectar are still being hauled in. I did a OA top vaporization two days ago and averaged between 25 to 45 mites the first day. Today the mite count is 5 to 15 per hive so far. I plan to treat again next Thursday. What should I expect from now on? Does the OA treatment eliminate all the mites? It seemed awfully easy and inexpensive. Is this too good to be true?

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the ~ox-{ at www.singingfalls.com (http://www.singingfalls.com)
If this message is edited it is because I have to correct my spelling again. 0_0

[Michael Bush]

Two treaments with no brood in the hive will kill "virtually" all the mites. Meaning it's doubtful you can find any. But nothing kills all the mites.

[ox]

Thanks Mr.Bush. I was really wondering about that since it seems that a certain level of mite population would have to be present in order for the bees to develope the skill to become hygienic/resistent to the mites. Reasonable thinking?

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the ~ox-{ at www.singingfalls.com (http://www.singingfalls.com)
If this message is edited it is because I have to correct my spelling again. 0_0

[Michael Bush]

>it seems that a certain level of mite population would have to be present in order for the bees to develope the skill to become hygienic/resistent to the mites. Reasonable thinking?

I think it's just insinct. They either have it or they don't.

[ox]

I think I might have done something wrong with the OA vapor treatment I don't have anywhere near the counts mentioned in other places. It's in the dozens not the hundreds. One of the hives was a spring swarm and the bees have never had any other treatments. I was really expecting more dead mites. Especially since i saw the distorted wing problem in one hive.
I followed instructions for the top hive pipe burn and saw a wisp of vapor from the hives about 2 minutes or so into the burn. I kept the hive sealed off for about 10 minutes while the pipe cooled down. Sound right?

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the ~ox-{ at www.singingfalls.com (http://www.singingfalls.com)
If this message is edited it is because I have to correct my spelling again. 0_0

[Michael Bush]

Maybe you don't have that many mites?

[BULLSEYE BILL]

>I think I might have done something wrong with the OA vapor treatment I don't have anywhere near the counts mentioned in other places. It's in the dozens not the hundreds.

We have been noticing better results when vaporizing from the bottom as the vapor tends to rise. Make sure that the SBB is sealed shut and use a heaping half teaspoon of acid. I weighed the acid on a triple beam and one half teaspoon compact and level is just under 2 gm. A heaping half is close to three gm.

The second treatment seems to have higher drop rates. The highest numbers will be seen on the second and third day after treatment.

[Dave W]

Greetings . . .

Oxalic Acid; Is it working?

8/30 - 28 Natural Fall Mite Count
8/31 - 33
9/8 - 34
9/27 - 73
9/30 - 83

10/1 First OA treatment - Used 1/2 "compact" teaspoon of crystals in BWrangler vaporizer, applied to top of middle and bottom (deep) chambers.

10/2 - 91 After Treatment
10/6 - 107
10/8 - 126

10/9 Second Treatment - Applied to top of bottom chamber only.

10/11 - 140 After Treatment


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Dave W . . .

Hobbyist - 1 Hive
First Package - Apr 03
Broodnest - 3 Deeps
Screened Bottom Board
Apistan - Aug 18, 03
Grease Patties - All year
2003/04 Winter Loss - 0%
See Forum1/HTML/001304, for ongoing mite counts.

[ox]

Well, shocker time on an easy shabbath day! I was out watching the bees in one of the hives and noticed quite a few newly hatched bees with deformed wings. The white paper mite count was the highest I'd seen it in this hive which was very low up until today. It's like a batch of brood hatched and all h--- broke loose. I did a panic and zapped them with a another dose of OA vapor. I just did a treatment last Thursday but this freaked me out today.
The bees are aggressively hauling out the sick offenders. I was patiently waiting for brood rearing to cease but it has been unusually balmy for October. Cool but no frosts at night and down right hot during the day. Pollen and nectar are still coming in so I'm assuming brood rearing will continue for some time. Am I going to be able to salvage this hive? There's no doubt that mites are dieing but are they going fast enough?

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the ~ox-{ at www.singingfalls.com (http://www.singingfalls.com)
If this message is edited it is because I have to correct my spelling again. 0_0

[Michael Bush]

That's been my observation in the past too. A hive will go from quite low counts and skyrocket very quickly.

I think you're on the right track. Hopefully there will still be enough healthy young bees to recover. And maybe you can hit them again when brood rearing quits.