who uses bee-go

[rainesridgefarm]

I have never used bee go before if you use it can you give me some insight. Does it change the flavor of the honey at all? I have heard the horror stories of spilling it in your car, basement and etc. But what about the honey if it does not come out of clothes does it effect the honey?

[RegotBee]

I appreciate you asking this question; I have been wondering about Bee-go also, but from a slightly different angle: I wonder if one were to use it for an extraction, say from a log or wall, can it be used to actually drive the queen off the brood comb and out of the hive?

[Zeke]

i used last year
according to the directions just make a X
on the fume board .
but i put too much on (according to directions .)
i put the fume board on the tailgate of my pickup whilst i was putting the be-go on the fume board and somehow got some on my suit
and it lingered in my suit for several weeks after.
but i tasted the honey that evenin as i was extracting i couldnt taste any be-go
in the honey .
Zeke

[ikeepbees]

I use Honey Robber from Mann Lake. I think it is the same as Bee Go with some stuff in it to make it smell less horrible. It works great. I have not noticed any transfer of the smell of the chemical to the taste or smell of the honey. I have found that it is very difficult to drive bees off of brood so I don't know if it will help you there.

------------------
Rob Koss

[honeyman46408]

I use Beego works great if it is hot enough but as already said DON`T get it on your cloths or in the truck! I know one BK that got some on his finger and ended up with a burn that was black and not noce to look at.
It has been my experance that if there is brood on the frame they will not leave. I tried the other stuff Fishers I think smells a lot better but didn`t work as good.

[mark williams]

honeyman: I use fisher'sBee-Quick.It smell's good & I have good luck with it.
I don't use bee-go , so I cannot compare it.
Also Bee-Quick Does not leave any taste in the honey.
We use Bee-Quick when we remove bee's from the inside of homes because it don't smell bad, as far as making the queen leave the brood it may work,But I think you would have to spray it almost on top of her.>>>>MARK

[beegee]

I used Bee-Go about 12 years ago when I was working with my commercial beekeeper-friend. The biggest thing was not to use too much of it and use it on a hot day. Better to use a little and let the fume board stay on a little longer. Too much and the bees got agitated(more than normal, I guess). It is rank-smelling stuff.

[Clayton]

Used both bee go and honey robber in the past before going biological methods. The stuff works fine. The heard that buyers were rejecting honey that had been harvested with these products as a smell was imparted to the honey (taste was fine). At the time I went to check out my own honey. I had to be honest with myself a hard thing to do at the time and I had to admit the smell was there. I decided to ditch the stuff as I don't want to ruin the wholesome reputation of honey for myself and others. To this day I still have supers with a very faint smell of honey robber.

Clay

[Daisy]

I haven't used it, and I don't think I want to start. I'd like to know how I'd take honey from twenty hives without it?.......

[dcross]

There's always abandonment...

[honeyman46408]

Daisy
Beeblower.

[Louise]

I've had great luck with a screen with one-way exit valves. Of course I only have 3 hives and only harvested from 2. And our nights are getting much colder (50's) which I think also helps. But I put it on one hive late afternoon and by the next morning there were only a few stragglers.

[Clayton]

Bee escapes. Brush. Abandonment. Blowers.

[Daisy]

Thanks folks.

About that beeblower. Aren't they expensive?

Will a hair blower work?

[Daisy]

About that hair blower.........

If it's not powerful enough, what if I put a piece of hose or something open meshed type of fabric over the air intake opening with beego on it? Think this would get the bees off and not overcome anything with odor?

[Clayton]

Daisey,

I think you would ruin a good hair dryer. I'd really consider the bee brush- its cheap! Causes no contamination to hive or honey. Doesn't hurt the bees. Its no big deal to harvest 20 colonies by brush.

[Louise]

And aren't hair blowers hot?

[beeman 202]

Applying Bee-Go to a hair-dryer is the most hair-brained idea I have heard. Bee-Go is very safe and effective when, on a warm sunny day you apply some to a fume-board, place the fume board on the hive, wait a few minutes, remove a super of honey free from bees, and repeat.

Bee-Go is effective and safe when used carefully and as directed.

[Dave W]

Greetings . . .

Maybe, if you sprinkled Bee-Go on a hot CURLING IRON, you could "FOG" them out.

Just a thought . . .
Dave W

[The Honey House]

I am a Bee-Go user and won't attempt to rob without. I never have found the smell to linger. Get some on you - that's a different story!

Here's what I've been doing for years.
1) Forget those fume boards you can buy.
2) When you order take out pizza, save the box.
3) Take an old super and cut it up into
smaller "supers" of about 1.5" high.
4)Staple the pizza box on the mini super
and cut off the overhang. The 16" large pizza boxes fit great.
5) Apply the bee-go and go rob the bees.
6) When finshed, hose the cardboard off with water and throw it in the recycle bin.
7) Save the mini supers for next year.

[This message has been edited by The Honey House (edited August 31, 2003).]

[loggermike]

My homemade fume boards are 3 inch rims with cloth stapled to it to hold the bee-go .Over that is stapled heavy duty black plastic to absorb the suns heat.A leaf blower is used to get out any remaining bees.I really hate blowing out any substantial amount of bees as the air quickly fills with lost confused bees.I tried some Bee-quick this spring and found it slower than Bee-Go.There always seemed to be 40 or50 bees left in each super that had to be blown out.Since I didnt have any help,I finished the yard with bee-go.Bee-quick smells better and I will try it again if I can get someone to come behind with the blower.

[This message has been edited by loggermike (edited August 31, 2003).]

[loggermike]

Went out today and pulled 60 supers using Bee-Quick.It was hotter today than the first time I tried it and seemed to work better.It really didnt take any longer than using Bee -Go and I dont think I brought in any more bees than normal.And you dont go into the house smelling like a pile of dog poop!

[WineMan]

Seems to take a higher temp or more direct sunlight to get it to work in comparison to bee go. But it smells nicer. Benzal??????/ whatever it is called smells nicer too and fortunately works at lower temps than bee go. I carry some of everything and try them all until they move out. Blower is the last resort. Blower always seems like a dandy way to make a big yard highly pissed in short order. Should be done pulling any time now.

[loggermike]

I had a blower with me too(and beego just in case).The farmers wife decided to start baleing hay fifty feet from the yard so I hesitated for a minute to even start.But the bees were in a good mood and by being careful,I figured I could pull it off without pissing off the yard.Didnt get a single sting and neither did the gal on the tractor.

[Michael Bush]

I have never used it and don't intend to. The only thing I see it good for is extractions. It's not difficult to put a bee escape on (I use the triangular ones that are the size of an inner cover) and wait overnight and finish off with a brush. In fact, if I'm in a hurry a brush will work fine by itself but I prefer not to have that many bees in the air.

[mnist]

Two methods of getting bees off frames for extraction that I heard of from my local assoc:
1. two "spritz's" from a water spray bottle of bee-go inside the inner cover, wait two minutes
2. blow them off the frame with a leaf-blower with exhaust directed away from the hive

[ikeepbees]

Welcome back Michael - how was your trip?

------------------
Rob Koss

[Michael Bush]

It was good. It takes a few days to get used to the altitude. There's just not much air at 9,400 feet.

[The Honey House]

Two methods of getting bees off frames for extraction that I heard of from my local assoc:
1. two "spritz's" from a water spray bottle of bee-go inside the inner cover, wait two minutes


NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO! NO!
NEVER SPRAY BEE-GO INSIDE THE HIVE OR ON PARTS OF THE HIVE.
IT MUST BE USED WITH A FUME BOARD OF SOME FASHION!

[jfisscher@supercollider.c]

Sorry to be so late in contributing to this thread, but it has been a busy summer, and I have not been looking at these forums. I will attempt to address all the questions posted to date.

First, some general things:

The pointed spout that comes with Bee-Go creates a solid "stream" of liquid. This stream splashes when it hits the fume board, which appears to be the primary mechanism that results in bee suits and clothes that must be discarded.It also saturates the fume board cloth in small areas, while leaving large areas untouched.

We started including pump-spray tops with Fischer's Bee-Quick (we make Bee-Quick) this spring at no extra charge. They are much more expensive to buy, but they make it almost impossible to saturate the fume board cloth, and reduce the chances of both over-use (waste) and liquid dripping off the cloth onto the top bars.

Fume boards themselves are the root cause of many problems. Some people simply harvest too late in the season to be able to use a fume board. The sun is supposed to heat up the metal top, which then heats the cloth, which vaporizes the repellent liquid. We like "breeze boards" much better. They are used by the really big commercial beekeepers, and are described here http://www.bee-quick.com/bee-quick/breeze.html

Breeze boards work even in temperatures so low that one hesitates to open the hive. You don't really need much breeze, and the
results are consistently superior to fume boards under all conditions. I assume that a breeze board would work as well for products other than Bee-Quick.

We are working on getting one or more of the woodenware vendors to offer a ready-made version of a breeze board, but they are
more bulky than a fume board. Better to make one yourself, or ask a friend with a saber saw to make one for you.

As for "which works better", all I can say is that Bee-Quick's label says "Full Refund If Not Satisfied" in large bold print.
No other product sold to beekeepers has an unconditional money-back guarantee. The interesting thing is that over the 4 years that Bee-Quick has been sold, we have had only 3 bottles returned to dealers out of about 40,000 sold. I can live with a 99.999925% customer satisfaction rate. You can't expect to please everyone.

From the number of 1-gallon and 5-gallon jugs of Bee-Quick selling every season, I don't think many of the large commercial beekeepers are using Bee-Go or Honey Robber any more. Bee-Quick is 100% food grade, and Bee-Go is not food grade at all. It is a hazardous material. Many commercial beekeepers have switched to Bee-Quick due to worker safety (OSHA) concerns, as both Bee-Go and Honey Robber have all those warnings on the bottle for a reason - they are required by law to have them. About the only "warning" for Bee-Quick is to avoid getting any in your eyes - it will sting like the dickens.

Now, some specific views on specific questions:

The "pizza box" approach mentioned would work only on the hottest days, as the cardboard is not going to get any hotter than the air temperature.

Like others that posted I feel that spraying any repellent into the hive (or on the inner cover) is a very bad idea.

As far as bee removal applications, there are some cases where one can put some Bee-Quick on a cloth and get the cloth into the cavity to "convince" the bees to move out the entrance. (This can also happen with
a hive if one uses too much, which is why we say "use less" so often.) I don't really see this as a common scenario, as one must still remove 100% of the comb to avoid having a swarm move back into the cavity, so you might was well open up the wall from the start.

I would not suggest that anyone ever use Bee-Go or Honey Robber in the wall of any structure occupied by humans, for obvious reasons.

As for bee escapes, brushing, abandonment, and blowers, all these approaches CAN work, but none are as consistently successful, as inexpensive, as easy, or as quick.

I really don't have any incentive to "push" Bee-Quick, as we donate all profits to the Eastern Apicultural Society Bee Research fund.

jim

[Mark Carden]

Thanks for your post. I use Fischer's and you have solved my only problem with the directions for building a breeze board. I can't wait to try it. Your product is great. I have been using an old inner cover with a towel stapled to it. I do crop polination and hate the inner covers and this is the only use I have found for them. Thanks for your post.

Mark Carden

[loggermike]

I too will have to try a breeze board as I cant get the Bee-Quick to work as fast as Bee-go on the cooler days.On the hot days it worked as well as beego and no matter what anyone thinks ,the smell is 10,000 times better.Pulling supers right now is a race to get the supers off and on the truck before robbing gets severe.It is worse in the areas where there are a lot of beeyards too close together,as is the case in the irrrigated areas of Kalifornia.I bought a gallon of it to try out so will stick with it till I get it right.

[James Urbish]

I use the dog vomit bee go on fume boards and even my wife who can smell gas when the house next door has a pilot light out can not smell it on the honey. I use a small amount . I rob at the hot part of the day. I don't get it on my gloves or on the supers. I store the supers over night in a big open shop with the top cover ajar to let the odor drift out and I can't smell it the next day when we extract. I don't know what else to do. I do know that years ago when we used the brush method that we had hundreds of stingers in our clothes and it was not safe to walk around the yard for days. One time last year we found a second queen in the third box just up above the excluder while useing the beego she was stuck in the excluder with about 10 bees around her. brood above and below the excluder. I think if you left it on a little longer it would drive them all out. I may try the bee quick next year. This is the only chemical that I use and don't like it.

[mnist]

>Like others that posted I feel that spraying any repellent into the hive (or on the inner cover) is a very bad idea.

I'm just an innocent newbie. While working with a veteran beekeeper this summer, spraying bee-go on top of the inner cover was the only method I saw him use.

He has a lot of hives and found that this was the most efficient way to clear bees off the honey supers. Please explain the bad points of this?

[loggermike]

No experience with putting it on an inner cover(we dont use them)but the smell of beego will linger for years(centuries?)on the fume boards.I wouldnt want it in any direct contact with the hive parts as it probably would irritate the bees until they could evaporate it.
I am going to pull 90 supers from a yard tomorrow .Wish there was time to make some breeze boards to try.There is no nectar coming in and the bees are defending their supers.So the first thing will be to take off every hive cover(except any weak hives or nucs).The bees will stop everything to guard the honey.This will allow some time to take off the supers before robbing starts.Clarence Wenner first came up with this idea and it works,but dont do it if there is another beeyard close by as they wont hesitate to rob.Using 8 fume boards will keep me running till the supers are off.Some hives seem especially sensitive to beego and will become stupored by it,so you always want to put the fume boards on sideways to the hive at first.This allows a lot of bees to fly out and the ventilation makes it work better.It also helps to go to the yard the day before and pull excluders and break the supers free so the bees can clean up the sticky burr comb ,and you can deal with the handfull of queens that always seem to make it through the excluders.This is all old stuff to a lot of you but might help someone.

[jfisscher@supercollider.c]

mnist said:

> While working with a veteran beekeeper this summer,
> spraying bee-go on top of the inner cover was the
> only method I saw him use.

> He has a lot of hives and found that this was the
> most efficient way to clear bees off the honey supers.
> Please explain the bad points of this?

Let me rant a bit here.

Nothing should be in honey except honey.
It is just that simple.

An inner cover is either plywood if it is a good one,
or masonite if it is a cheap piece of crap. Neither
are generally considered "absorbent materials".

If you spray a liquid on a plywood or masonite
surface, and then place that surface over the supers,
what happens to the liquid? It has to drip down onto
the frames and the combs. This is a big non-no.
You never want ANYTHING to come into direct contact
with honey, comb, or frames, since it will certainly
come off in the extractor, and get into the honey.

There are some people who have been misinformed, and
think that butyric anhydride (the active component of
Bee-Go and Honey Robber) oxidizes to butyric acid, and
think "that's OK", as tiny amounts of butyric acid are
found in all honey. Only SOME of the chemical goes
through this reaction process. Nowhere near all.

Butyric anhydride is not food grade for human food.
It is permitted as an additive for animal feed, but
it is not "generally recognized as safe" by the FDA,
nor is it listed as an "approved food-contact substance"
by the FDA. The EPA "exemption from the requirement for
a tolerance" for butyric was revoked by the EPA back in
1998 (see page 6 of http://www.epa.gov/oppfead1/fqpa/revoked.pdf.
The EPA uses the synonym "Butanoic Anhydride" as
the formal name for the chemical. Same thing. With
this revocation, there is no remaining "food use"
for this chemical.

So, what part of "no food use" is unclear?
Heck I dunno, the EPA and FDA have much bigger
problems to worry about, and the "honey industry"
tends to be a self-regulating group of responsible
people. An administration that quietly reclassifies
carbon dioxide as "not a pollutant" http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2003/09/20030916-6.html http://news.independent.co.uk/world/americas/story.jsp?story=438719 http://www.motherjones.com/news/dailymojo/2003/36/we_538_03a.html
is not going to "enforce" much of anything, is it?

Now, fast-forward to "later", after you have harvested.
The supers are removed, and the inner cover is back on
the hive. The bees are still exposed to the residue
of the Bee-Go, and will walk in/on it, spread it around,
and get it all over the hive.

As many have pointed out, the odor of butyric anhydride
is amazingly persistent to many noses. Long after it is
no longer repellent to bees, it remains repellent to humans.
Your inner cover is going to smell terrible for a long,
long time. So will you, since you must handle the inner
cover.

Enough said. You get the idea.

jim

[wishthecuttlefish]

Section 2 of George Imirie's pink pages for May 2003 has an excellent run down on the options for getting bee's out of supers:
http://www.beekeeper.org/may2003.html