Northern overwintering nuc setup

[Maine_Beekeeper]

I have two 5 frame nucs I'm planning on trying to overwinter.
Our plan is to put them up over a strong 2 deep hive.
We built a bottom which is essentially an outer cover with two large holes cut in the base (1/2" plywood) with hardware cloth on both top and bottom to prevent bee travel but allow heat to rise up.
The nucs will go on top of this base/cover each with spacer boards on top(for candy/pollen feeding) and then migratory covers on top.
Please see photos here
http://s76.photobucket.com/albums/j37/Maine_Beekeeper/?action=view&current=Observationhiverestrictor010.jpg&refPage=&imgAnch=imgAnch1

I am undecided on placing an inner cover over the 2 deep hive below this cover/bottom (to aid in candy/pollen feeding or perhaps just putting a spacer, thus creating better air/heat flow.

We will put a homosote top on each of the nucs with the groove cut to outside side for ventillation.

Plan is to wrap the lower hive with tarpaper and also wrap the two nucs together with tarpaper but separate from the lower hive.

Any comments/advise would be appreciated.
Thanks in advance!

[poor man]

Hi, the only thing that i can comment on would be the tarpaper, would it be better to use some tyvex(sp) house wrap? it will breath and might help with condensation build up? if im wrong im shure sombody will correct me...

[BerkeyDavid]

Hi Maine. I am doing the same thing this year, trying to overwinter 2 five frame nucs.

THis will be my first time to. Like Poor man, I am concerned about condensation. But not from the tar paper, but from the hive below. I would not have the open screen between the hives. Unless you do something special above.

Look at Tim Tarheit's honey run web site Insulated inner cover (http://www.honeyrunapiaries.com/plans/all_season_inner.pdf)

THis is what I am making.

we will see how it goes...

Also there was a similar plan for insulated top in the bee journals this summer when they talked about overwintereing nucs.

Sure hope it works. smile.gif

[BerkeyDavid]

Poor Man
THere was an article in the ABJ in October about an experiment. Wrapping with Tar paper turned out to be a good thing, at least for Western Mass.

So my plan is to wrap with tar paper and add an empty super on top with insulation and ventilation.

[Michael Bush]

When I did a similar plan the condensation did the nuc on top in. I would just have a thin (1/4 luan would work) barrier that won't let the condensation in but will let some heat through.

[Maine_Beekeeper]

MB -
The almost perfect husband thinks that a barrier (luan, etc) between the hive and the nucs will create condensation at that barrier point causing drip down on the hive below.
He thinks the moisture issue needs to be taken care of at the very top of the hive.
Hot chases cold, a barrier will create a "cold sink" the barrier will eliminate the benefit to the nucs above. These are his arguments...
Unfortunately he has a better understanding of physics and architecture than I do so I can't argue except to say "i'm not so sure you're right about this..."
I've got to admit he knows a lot about building, moisture, air flow and pressure, etc.
It all leads me to think we need a really good wicking barrier at the top of the hive at least.

[dgl1948]

I would wrap with insulation. This should stop the condensation. We use R12 bats in black plastic. We also use a small top entrance. Our winters are cold. Without the insulation the warm air inside the hives creates condensation when it touches the cold wall. I have a couple of pictures here.
http://doulong.sasktelwebsite.net/

[kamerrill]

Try it and see how it works. The screen thing doesn’t work for me (for over wintering that is). Too much moisture. But then again, I don’t use anything to absorb moisture.

Increase Essentials by Larry Connor is a new book out from wicwas press that discusses (in part) northern nuc wintering strategies - A very good book to add to your collection.

K. Webster and M. Palmer both commercial beekeepers in Northern Vermont over-winter hundreds of 8 and 4 frame nucs respectfully in "standard" equipment. Do a search for their names on this site and you'll get some good leads.

My success rate has been pretty good for my 4 and 5 frame nucs over the last 2 years borrowing in part from their techniques. Going into winter this year, I have 40 nucs strong, heavy (20-25lbs of stores) and ready to take care of themselves until April.

I have the 4-frame (actually many grew into 8) nucs in a deeps on a divided BB. I placed the nucs on top of the inner cover of a double deep hive. The nucs have a grain bag inner cover and on top of that I put a chunk of insulation followed by a t-cover. I wrap them separately in tar paper and say good bye to them until March. I don't provide any upper ventilation holes for the nucs. I check them in early April on a nice day and if they are short, I drop in a frame of honey that I saved-out as feed.

[dickm]

<<<<I would wrap with insulation. This should stop the condensation.>>>>
Not by itself. Imagine a 3# dog living in the hive and breathing. The water has to go somewhere.(You have 3# of bees?)

<<< We also use a small top entrance>>>

That's what does the job.

>>>Without the insulation the warm air inside the hives creates condensation >>>

The trick is to get the moisture to condense outside, not on the bees. I leave a miller feeder on all winter (Empty) and block up the outer cover 3/4 inch. (No other cover) That way the moisture goes through the feeder, condenses on the "roof" and runs down the inside of the cover. I have SBBs so there is a lot of air available at the bottom.

dickm