Introduced queen killed

[suthrnslew]

Hi, I'm new here and fairly new to beekeeping. This spring's packaged bee hive swarmed a couple weeks ago. A couple days later I found the swarm cluster and did my best to get them all in an empty deep. I wasn't sure I got the queen. I put in frames and a week later I checked the progress.
They were building comb, but I didn't see any eggs, larvae or the queen...but then I have a hard time spotting the queen anyway. A week after that I checked again and all I saw was comb being filled with honey, no eggs or larvae. I ordered a queen and yesterday introduced her to the hive. Two hours later,
I saw she had been killed and escorted out the hive entrance, I had ordered a marked queen, so it was easy for me to spot what had happened.
Did I not wait long enough for an existing queen in the hive to start laying eggs or maybe I shouldn't have immediately released he from the cage instead of letting her work her way out the candy so the others would accept her in a couple days?

[Clayton]

I would sooner bet you have a queen in the swarm hive. But its hard to guess this without seeing. But to bee on the safe side it is best when starting out not to direct release the queen but rather use the candy to release. If in a day the bees are still biting the screen you know they won't accept her most likely due to a queen already there.

Clay

[Michael Bush]

I tend to agree with Clayton. First off, eggs are hard to spot on new comb unless you have really good eyesight. Second, if it was a virgin queen in the swarm, it will be a week or more before she's been mated and settled into laying regularly.

But if you want to be more careful about installing a queen you can do things more slowly. Leave the cage in for a few days and then put a hole in the candy or just release her if they seem to have accepted her.

If there's a queen in the hive they will usually kill the new queen in the cage.

[Michael Bush]

Also, you are saying that the hive swamred a couple of days before you found the swarm? If so, I think this is an afterswarm and not the original swarm, which would mean it has a virgin queen.


[This message has been edited by Michael Bush (edited August 01, 2003).]

[suthrnslew]

Yes, I found the swarm cluster a couple days after they swarmed from the hive, roughly 3-4 lbs of bees.
I figured they made a new queen in the hive and split due to crowding.
I wasn't sure I got the queen from the cluster when I knocked them into the empty deep. I feel bad I couldn't spot an existing queen or didn't leave the new queen in the cage for a couple days to see if they would accept her.

[Michael Bush]

If it's a virgin, she's VERY hard to spot. First she is smaller than a laying queen. Second, she doesn't MOVE like a laying queen. She is very shy and hides behind anything and anyone.

[ChellesBees]

suthrnslew,don't feel too bad, we all make mistakes (except maybe MB http://www.beesource.com/ubb/smile.gif) Swarms, killed queens, not finding queens,...been there, done that, still learning. Just know that you are not alone, and keep trying.
After awhile, the queens get easier to find, as do the eggs, but I'm talking second or third year here. The fact that you managed to catch the swarm from a first year hive is pretty good.
While it is ok to release a queen from a package when you hive it, ( it works for me, and that is what U of MN teaches) When you re-queen or introduce a queen to a new set of bees,ie. a swarm or a queenless hive, it is best to give them a few days. Even then, I had three different queens killed this year. Hang in there, and good luck.
Michelle

[suthrnslew]

I appreciate the replies, sharing your knowledge, and words of encouragement.
I originally bought a hive to help pollinate my raspberry crop, but have now become so fascinated with honey bees, that I intend to keep adding more hives.
Thanks again, Bill

[Michael Bush]

>we all make mistakes (except maybe MB )

I made several this week and once posted my worst ones.
http://www.beesource.com/ubb/Forum1/HTML/000589.html

I had a boss who used to say "if you're not making mistakes, you're not doing anything." I like to modify it and say "If you're not making mistakes, you're not learning anything." Beacause if you push the limits of your knowledge you will make mistakes and if you don't push the limits you won't learn anything. http://www.beesource.com/ubb/smile.gif

[dickm]

I had an old farmer friend who used to say, "You never learn anything by doing it right!"