Horizontal hives

[dtwilliamson]

MB, I have noticed in several posts you have discussed going to horizontal hives. Are you referring to TBH's or some other configuration? If it is other than TBH's could you explain?

Thanks,

Dan

[Michael Bush]

I have two hives that are medium depth three box long (48 3/4" x 19 7/8" x 7 1/4" which includes the 3/4" space at the botom) hives. This is 33 frames. I bought some of the corragated plastic "cardboard" for the slide in tray under the screened bottom board. I have three migratory covers for the lids with an entrance built into the front one. One of I used a bunch of migratory covers from 5 frame nucs on it, so you can open up just five frames or so at a time instead of 10 or 11 or so. Over this I put a sheet of the plastic cardboard held down by two concrete blocks. I made a small migratory cover (3 1/2" wide) for the very front for the entrance.

I also have two other "semi" horizontal hives that I'm experimenting with. They are based on having two towers, one of brood and one of honey. One is a two box wide medium box (32 1/2 x 19 7/8") on the bottom with a queen excluder splitting it in half. Unfortunately the bees haven't been willing to cross the excluder yet, so I'm not sure how it will go yet. The other is simply a two box wide botom board with a stack of brood on one side and honey on the other. If the supers get higher than the brood nest I will put a top enrance on both. Again, so far the bees are reluctant to work the second stack, so I'm not sure how this will work out when they really fill the brood area.

I have done variations of this that are on the board in deeps before I went to mediums.
http://www.beesource.com/eob/althive/bush/index.htm

(click on the pictures for more info and more pictures)

This was intended to be a combination TBH and standard deep frames. The combs on the top bars in this size collapsed on me. I'm not sure if I had left them alone until they aged and got stronger if this could have been avoided, but I decided to move to mediums or Dadant deeps anyway. So I am now running one hive in medium depth with top bars and will probably mix in frames later.

I have also built a long Dadant deep hive that I will move my currnt Dadant deep hive into when they fill the space they have now. I have a five frame Dadant deep nuc that I started them in, and they are now in ten frame box. I also have a double wide (22 frame) and a triple wide box. I will move them up as they fill the space. Of course, if you are going horizontal (one story) it makes sense to be a bit taller for that one story.

The object is to get the advantages of a TBH with the advantages of frames and standard equipment and standard supers.

The MAIN advantage I'm looking for is to ELIMINATE lifting supers for any reason other than harvesting them.

I have considered several variations including 8" wide plexiglass inner covers (so you can see WHERE you want to open the hive and then only open a small area) or a top bar frame where there are no gaps at the top. I LOVE how calm the bees stay in the top bar hive. They are AMAZINGLY calm. So I'd like to get that advantage with frames to support the combs.

The one in the pictures was on a table. I found that lids blow off more and other problems occur so all my current horizontal hives are on the ground intead. I have a Merril toolbox I use for a stool to work them, but a nuc box on it's side works well too.

[dtwilliamson]

Very interesting.... I like the concept of basically TBH's with frames. Photos are worth a million words. Thanks. Please keep us updated on the success or failures of this method.

Also why do you think the TBH bees are so calm?

[Michael Bush]

>Also why do you think the TBH bees are so calm?

I'm guessing that there are two basic reasons. One is you only open up a little at a time. You are usually only exposing the faces of two combs and because the bars have no gaps for the bees the rest of the hive is still closed. The second is that the combs are connected directly the bar so there isn't much air moving across the top. Maybe this slows down an alarm moving through the hive.

I'm trying to take advantage of one by using the five frame inner covers to see if just opening a few frames at a time helps.

But another reason is you don't have to move five boxes of bees off, upsetting each as you go, just to get to the brood chamber. http://www.beesource.com/ubb/smile.gif

[Scot Mc Pherson]

Michael >>
But another reason is you don't have to move five boxes of bees off, upsetting each as you go, just to get to the brood chamber.


This also depends on your top bar hive design. Since Michael's entrances to his top bar hive's are simply a missing top bar at the front, then michael works the hive from front to back. This can be advantageous from the point of view that you can get to the brood nest without disturbing the whole hive first. The offset of a top bar hive is that you can't just pull a top bar striaght up, you have to have some room to pull the bar up otherwise you are going to kill / piss off a lot of bees that get rolled (possibly including the queen). You need to be able to work from one end or the other, pull out and empty top bar / plug bar and then draw the bars a littel away from its neighbor before drawing it up. Michael's draw space starts in the front, my draw space starts at the back away from the entrance at the front. THis has the advantage that if I am just there to harvest honey, I can just harvest honey without the bees even noticing it.

I am not sure if michael's design allows for starting bar removals from the back or not, but it would be advantageous to be abel to do so.

Further working from the back tot he front of the hive isn't traumatic for the bees. There aren't usually many bees in the honey stores relatively speaking, and so working throught he honey stores is usually a snap IMO.

[Michael Bush]

>I am not sure if michael's design allows for starting bar removals from the back or not, but it would be advantageous to be abel to do so.

I can start at either end if I want. You have to make room in a regular hive too or you will roll them bees, but at least you don't break the comb off with fames.