Deeps, mediums, shallows

[Hobie]

I see many people use all medium supers. Would there be anything wrong with using one deep and then some shallows for the brood chamber?

[Christopher Petree]

No. You can have the queen lay in any sized super you like.

[Michael Bush]

Here's what's wrong:
http://www.bushfarms.com/beeslazy.htm#uniformframesize

The bees won't care. But you might find it easier if they are all the same.

[ September 28, 2006, 08:27 PM: Message edited by: Michael Bush ]

[Christopher Petree]

What Michael says is true--uniformity has its advantages. I like using some shallows on a few hives to make early splits. I let the queen go in and lay in the shallow, remove it, then add a queen or let them grow one. You can do this with bigger boxes of course, but the shallows are easier to move around and don't drastically affect the bee population of the parent hive. This method also decreases the need for several extra nucs.

[power napper]

Hobie-Like most beekeepers we have used anything available. Now we are a totally medium supers and even medium frame observation hive and all the nucs are mediums. Only one size has a lot of advantages to our beekeeping. Now that I don't want to lift anything heavy is another reason for using all mediums.

[sierrabees]

I have been using a deep with one or two small or mediums on top. The advantage comes when having to lift them, the disadvantage comes when you want to move frames to transfer queen cells or to give brood or food from one hive to another. It seems that I always have what I want to move in the wrong size frame for the box I want to move it into. If you are going to move your hives around as I do there is another disadvantage to having different size equipment. It is hard to tie everything down on a trailer securely if one hive is an inch or so shorter than the ones next to it.

I like full depth for the bottom super because the queen seems to move through it more readily when she doesn't have a space to cross.

I like small supers above the bottom because these are the ones I have to lift most often.

I like mediums for honey supers because with my extractor I have to turn the frames at least twice after the first spin. The mediums are a compromise between getting the most honey with the least handling using deeps, and less lifting but more handling per pound of honey using shallows.

[Hobie]

Where were all of you when I was buying woodenware? ;) Uh... oh, you were here, and where was I??? Oh 20-20 hindsight!

[Michael Bush]

Sometimes I feel like I'm preaching if I repeat my advice too often. I don't want to preach. But I'd buy eight frame mediums for everything. 48 pounds is still heavy but it's a nice heavy. smile.gif All the same size is wonderful.

To put it another way, when I had deeps for brood chambers and I had to lift ONE full box, I hurt for several weeks. When I went to all ten frame mediums and I lifted boxes all day, I hurt for a week. When I went to all eight frame mediums, and I lift boxes all day, I ache a bit the day after.

[Ann]

We're running all mediums, three for them, the rest (hopefully) for us. It gets cold here, winter is kinda long, but not as long as up in Maine, where we're going to put more hives this coming season.

I had a conversation with Lincoln Sennett, a guy who runs Swans Honey up in Albion, Maine, at the Common Ground Fair last weekend. He said he doesn't like to run the three mediums in these climates because he doesn't like the break in the brood chamber - two in a medium setup. Do any of you in colder climates have experience running three mediums through a cold winter? We bought hive wrap from Betterbee to try out, any thoughts?

[Michael Bush]

Research that Steve at Brushy Mt used to quote says they winter better in mediums because of better communication horizontally. I notice in the deeps and Dadant deeps sometimes a small cluster gets stuck on the other side of a frame and doesn't get back with the cluster. I think they winter better in the mediums.

We get 20 below F for a week or so most winters. I've run all mediums now for five years. I've run all eight frame mediums for the last two. Before that I ran ten frame deeps for brood.

My thoughts? Stick with the mediums. Better yet, go to eight frame mediums. smile.gif

[Ann]

Thank you, Michael, you've given me confidence that had eked away last weekend! smile.gif Do you wrap your hives?

[Michael Bush]

>Do you wrap your hives?

As an experiment, once, in the last 32 years. I probably won't do it again because the hives stayed wet all winter from the condensation. I probably will put styrofoam on the lids.

[Hobie]

Michael, In my opinion, you can "preach" all you want. I am always grateful for the advice, even if it means I screwed up. How else do us newbies learn? I'm not one of those who needs to re-learn lessons already learned by someone else(especially painful ones).

[allrawpaul]

I have all shallow supers, to keep the weight to a minimum and make everything interchangeable. The two main disadvantages I have found are that I have to build double the frames and boxes and when inspecting hives and looking for the queen, I have to inspect twice the number of frames which takes a lot longer. Its not a big prob if you only have a few hives like myself, but if I had a lot of hives, I would use deeps for brood and shallows for honey.

[Tia]

I'd love to have nothing but mediums, but when I bought out my teacher, I got tons of deeps and shallows. I've cut down the deeps to mediums and I'm trying to trade with my bee club members, two shallow for one medium, but I've had only one taker so far. So my bees are in whatever's handy and it is a pain. Lots of times I wish I could switch frames but can't because they're not the same size. One of these days. . .