mouse evictions during cool temperatures

[artic]

I was out by my hive today checking feed levels and have noticed evidence that mouse moved into the hive, namely bee pieces and mouse droppings collected on the tray bellow my screened bottom board. The average high temperature has been around 40 something for about a week now. I was told not to put a mouse guard until the drones have been kicked out, they haven't been, so I didn't, guess I was told wrong. Is it best for me to rip open the hive even with the cool Temperature, or should I wait until the predicted high on Friday (around 59)? Is there something else to I should do to rid of the mouse while keeping the hive closed until it warms up?

[Dave W]

artic . . .

Sometimes I find small "pellets" on my sticky-board. They look somewhat like very small mouse droppings. Is this what your seeing? I think mine are wax worm droppings.

Bee pieces can occur with robbing too.

Are you sure you have a mouse?

[ November 29, 2005, 03:11 PM: Message edited by: Dave W ]

[Michael Bush]

I would put mouse gaurd on when the nights start getting cold. 1/4" hardware cloth is my favorite mouse gaurd.

I'd get a wire clothes hanger (or similar gauge wire) and use the hook end to reach in and drag out any nest or possibly scare out any mouse. If you can't catch on a nest, or mouse nest materials (grass, milkweed down etc.) I'd figure there probably isn't a mouse, although it's possible it's eaten a hole in the combs and built it up off of the bottom board. But you'd probably catch SOME material. Once you're pretty sure you didn't find any mouse nest material or you GOT the mouse nest material and you saw the mice run out, I'd put the guard on. If you did find some evidence of a mouse, on a warm day (when the bees are flying) I'd tear it down to the bottom board and make sure they've been evicted.

[artic]

Dave I've noticed no robbing, I've only have the one hive. However it could be possible as I have been feeding 1:1 with homemade HBH. The thing is, all the bee pieces, and droppings, were concentrated to one smaller area. I've had no past experience with wax moths, I suppose that too may be the problem.

Michael Bush what do you consider 'getting cold'?
I swept the bottom area with a near by thorny branch, and did not catch any sort of nest or frighten a mouse. I also took a flash light and went under the hive, auto mechanic style, and looked through the screened bottom board, I saw no added evidence of a mouse. I doubt a mouse built nest in the comb, as I have not seen an excess amount of wax particles along side the bee pieces.

I'll tear down the hive once it warms up enough just to be sure as to what the problem was, and evict anything thing that does not belong. Afterwards I'll be sure to install a nice mouse guard.

[Jackbee]

My solution for mouse control is placing my hives on 1/2 plastic 55 gal drums. Cut in half the drum hive stands are 18" or so. I make a cross with 2x4's and reinforce the drum at the cut opeaning to keep the roundness of the drum intact. Once cut plastic drums tend to sorta squeeeeze or close up at the cut end.

I also place, and fasten, a piece of aluminum sheeting on top of the drum ( a traffic stop sign is just right ) ;) or under the hive bottom. ( this advice is not ment to encourage annoying traffic signage removal ) :D

I don't think a mouse can scramble up on the plastic and for sure can't grip the aluminum since it overhangs. :cool:

I also place the drum stand on sheet metal that is laying on the ground.

All my methods are not practical for large operations but for a few hive it's good so far.

[Michael Bush]

>The thing is, all the bee pieces, and droppings, were concentrated to one smaller area. I've had no past experience with wax moths, I suppose that too may be the problem.

Wax moths are often concentrated in a small area. The wax moth dropings are square on the ends. If you reload, it's like IMR gunpowder. The mouse droppings are kind of round on the ends.

>Michael Bush what do you consider 'getting cold'?

If the bees are clustered (30s or 40s) then it's probably time to keep the mice out. If it's freezing at night, it's definitely time to put the mouse gaurds on.

>I swept the bottom area with a near by thorny branch, and did not catch any sort of nest or frighten a mouse. I also took a flash light and went under the hive, auto mechanic style, and looked through the screened bottom board, I saw no added evidence of a mouse. I doubt a mouse built nest in the comb, as I have not seen an excess amount of wax particles along side the bee pieces.

Then I'm guessing it's wax moth droppings. If you get a warm day, I'd look in and see what you've got as far as moths, webbing, etc. Maybe the bees have more space than they need.

>I'll tear down the hive once it warms up enough just to be sure as to what the problem was, and evict anything thing that does not belong. Afterwards I'll be sure to install a nice mouse guard.

Sounds like a plan.

[Michael Bush]

>My solution for mouse control is...

My current solution is top entrances. With no entrance on the bottom I've never had a mouse get in. smile.gif I also don't have to dig the entrances out of the snow or even cut the grass so the bees can get in and out. I also don't have skunk problems. But before that, I used the 1/4" hardware cloth.

[Tia]

How strong is your hive? I found a dead, propolized mouse in one of the hives when they were out at the strawberry fields. The other day during home hive inspection, I found a dead lizard. My girls seem to take care of anybody that invades their space. Maybe yours did too.

[ScadsOBees]

I had a mouse "visitor" this fall. The droppings were mostly concentrated, and being worried that the mouse had taken up residence, I tore down the bottom box, and whereas there was not a mouse in residence, a mouse had definately been in there eating pollen comb.

Before tearing down, clean your SBB insert and get those mouse gaurds on. If the mouse is still there, you will see more droppings and you a have work to do. If not, then if there had been a mouse, it was just snacking when the bees are clustered and the bees can repair the damage in the spring easily enough.

[Michael Bush]

>My girls seem to take care of anybody that invades their space.

When it's warm and the hive is strong this is generally the case. In the winter when the colony is clustered and the mouse has had time to build a good nest for protection on warm days, the bees generally don't manage to evict (or kill) them.

[Tia]

Good point, Michael. I guess living here on the Crystal Coast, I have a tendency to forget that you guys don't get "flying time" during the winter. Around here we usually get at least one day a week when the bees can take cleansing flights, do housekeeping, etc.

[artic]

Well as luck would have it my girls were flying today, it was in the mid 50's. I guess Russians really do fly during colder temperatures. Amazingly they are still bringing in minuscule amounts of pollen. I had the chance to strip the hive down to the bottom board. I saw no evidence of a mouse, nor was their any wax moth webbing etc. All looked well as far as I could tell. Plenty of bees, lots of stores, no incredible amount of uncapped brood, more brace comb than I would have liked, I didn't spot the queen but did see young brood, all and all an apparently healthy hive. I must have simply had a visitor that enjoyed the taste of bees.

I cleaned the bottom tray the day I originally reported the problem, and again there were more bee pieces and droppings on it today. The newly installed mouse guard should hopefully prevent any more visits.

Thanks for you help/recommendations everyone.

Also, as a side note, if you enjoy taking your camera out to photograph the bees, I find using a waterproof case for may camera makes things so much easier during clean up. I bought it for SCUBA photography, but I think I have used it more for bee photography.

[Tia]

<more brace comb than I would have liked>
Mine had a lot of brace comb, too. Is that a problem?

[artic]

Tia wrote:
Mine had a lot of brace comb, too. Is that a problem?Only when you've got a bad back, and can't seem to easily separate your frames from each other or force two deeps apart. Not to mention it makes a sticky(er) mess of things, and increases the chances of bee mortality.

Other than that, I think it is a fine sign that there exists plenty of winter stores in the hive when the bees fill up not only the frames, but also extra bits of comb between teh two stories.