Can Bees "OD" on FUMAGILIN-B?

[Bob D]

OK, you guys/gals must get a kick out of us newbees! Some of the questions....

I mixed the FUMAGILIN-B with the 50/50 syrup and it made 1 gallon. In actuality, 1/2 the gallon container was filled with sugar and the heated water was poured into the container. All together, when mixed and desolved, there was 1 gallon of Syrup (so actually, only a 1/2 gallon or a bit more of water was added) So, I added enough FUMAGILIN-B for 1 gallon of syrup.

Today, I checked the feeders. The feeder that was nearly empty had a dozen dead bees under the feeder (boardman feeder). The other two had about 25% of the syrup taken and no dead bees. However, I have 1 colony with a division board feeder that had hardly ANY activity around the hive today. I don't want to open the hives because I just installed them Saturday. I don't want them to ball the queen by me checking them too much.

Did I mix it wrong? Can bees OD on FUMAGILIN-B?

OK, OK, I know, when you gather yourself together and control your laughter enough to answer, I'll be waiting for the response..... I can't wait to know what I'm doing and not have to ask these questions anymore....

Thanks everyone...., for your help and for dealing with me!

Bob D
Brentwood, NH.

[Michael Bush]

I have no actual experience with Fumidil or Fumigillan. I have no idea, but it sounds like you mixed it right doesn't it?

[Jim Fischer]

As I recall, a "safety factor" of something like
50 to 75 times the usual dose was mentioned as
the difference between the suggested dose and
the point at which the stuff becomes "toxic to bees".

Given the above, I don't think you are seeing
any sort of mortality from an overdose. Anyway,
12 bees out of a split or package is not a
very big deal.

Dead bees under a boardman feeder could have
been dragged there by house bees removing the
bodies of bees who died from any/all causes.
Sometimes, dragging the dead "near" the entrance
is all the house cleaning the bees do (rather
like my approach to house cleaning, which often
consists of nothing more than sweeping the room
with a baleful glare).

Another possibility is that these were bees
from one of your other colonies (or a nearby
colony unknown to you) attempting to rob from
the feeder, and were killed by the colony having
the boardman feeder. Using any entrance feeder
is an act of faith akin to putting the entire
contents of your pantry on the front porch of
your house, and then somehow expecting the
neighborhood dogs and cats to show restraint. smile.gif

Give these new colonies (I assume that "installed"
means packages or nucs) a few weeks to draw
some comb and get settled in before worrying
about anything other than "a laying queen".

> I don't want to open the hives because I just
> installed them Saturday. I don't want them to
> ball the queen by me checking them too much.

OK, check on Wednesday if you want. I'd bet
that by Monday the queen would have been
released and laying if you installed them on
Saturday. Bees really want their queen
released and laying.

Tales of beekeepers opening new packages or
nucs and thereby causing the queen to be balled
are, in my view, myths. If the queen provided
is the only queen around, the bees realize this
within hours, not days. They also realize that
they are queenless within hours, rather than days.
Even if the package was shaken or the nuc was
made up the day before you installed it, the bees
in the package or nuc have had at least a full
day to become accustomed to that "new queen smell".

I've pulled out old queens in the morning, and
installed new queens after lunch on the same
day. I use mini-marshmallows as "candy", which
the bees can chew through in a matter of a few
hours, so I'm out the next day removing queen
cages, and looking for some eggs. I'm not saying
that my failure rate is ever zero, but its low
enough that I have not become paranoid about my
"accelerated process", as my failure rate is
about what one would expect from any approach.
(Overall, 2% to 5% end up queenless or supersede
in the summer following the requeening, be it
spring requeening or fall requeening.)

[Bob D]

Well, If I would have had to overdose them by 50 to 75% before it becomes fatal, I don't know if I had enough left in the bottle to do any damage.... So, it sounds like I am safe there.... I was more concerned of I mixed up a tspn and a tblspn or something....

I'll keep an eye on them.

Thanks!

I can't wait to have a couple good years under my belt! Then I may be able to be answering silly questions rather than asking them! LOL!

Thank you so much!

[tecumseh]

the only silly question is one that you should of asked but did not.

[peggjam]

"Tales of beekeepers opening new packages or
nucs and thereby causing the queen to be balled
are, in my view, myths. If the queen provided
is the only queen around, the bees realize this
within hours, not days. They also realize that
they are queenless within hours, rather than days.
Even if the package was shaken or the nuc was
made up the day before you installed it, the bees
in the package or nuc have had at least a full
day to become accustomed to that "new queen smell"."

I'll go along with that statement on packages, Jim, but not nucs. The problem with queens only hours or days old being set free in nucs is real. If there are any queencells in these nucs and you set your queen free, there is a 50-50 chance she will be balled. I've seen it happen.

[Jim Fischer]

> The problem with queens only hours or days old
> being set free in nucs is real.

Sorry, I was speaking of mated queens,
such as are provided by commercial suppliers
of packages and nucs to hobby beekeepers.

But if there is a queen cell in a nuc, and
you missed it when adding a queen or another
queen cell, whose fault is that? smile.gif

[peggjam]

"But if there is a queen cell in a nuc, and
you missed it when adding a queen or another
queen cell, whose fault is that?"

Tis true, tis true!! I don't think alot of people think to look for queencells in nucs when installing new, mated queens.