Captured my first swarm, now I have questions

[Gene Weitzel]

Yesterday I got a call from my daughter-in-law's uncle. He works at an oil field tubular products yard. They had a swarm of bees that had collected on the end of a 40' peice of 10" casing in one of the pipe stacks. When I arrived, the bees covered about 8" on the outside but the inside of the pipe was completely full of bees to a depth of about 18" from the end (at least 4-5 lbs of bees maybe more!). I tried setting a hive body with drawn comb a few feet away but they pretty much ignored it. Since they wanted the bees cleared out right away (they had already exterminated 3 large swarms a couple weeks earlier) I decided to put the hive right below the end of the pipe and then reached into it up to my elbow and scooped the bees into the hive. I then placed it about 5' away on the ground. They soon swarmed all over the hive. I had put the covers on and sat down to wait for them crawl into the hive entrance. When there was just a beard on the side where the entrance was I figured I was just about done. All of the sudden they begain to pour out of the hive. I quickly closed off the entrance but not before a pretty large cloud had take off. They flew off about 100 feet and then it was like they said to themselves "wait a minute , we forgot the queen!" and they came back and swarmed all over the screen on the bottom. I let them sit for about 30 minutes until they were crawling up the side and gathering around the closed entrance. I opened up again and the ones inside came boiling out again while the others were trying to get back in. They finally all boiled out and collected up again about 10 feet away on a catwalk that was laying on its side on the ground. In the mean time a helper brought me a can of Lemon Pledge and I squirted a little on the inside walls of the hive and placed it directly under the swarm. I used a bee brush and was able to drop almost the entire swarm into the box. I placed a queen excluder on it along with my upper entrance spacer which was completely closed, then the hivetop feeder and inner cover. The rest of the bees just streamed in through the hole on the inner cover. When all were in save a few stragglers, I put on the outer cover, strapped the hive together and loaded it into the truck and left.

Now I have a few questions:

1. Given the circumstances, was there a better way to handle it?

2. I had removed all but about 4 or 5 frames when I dropped the swarm in. I did not want to mess with them to put the rest of the frames back in for fear of them taking off again. How long should I wait before trying to re-insert the rest of the frames?

3. I kept the hive closed up until about 10:00 pm, and then I gave them about a 1" opening and put two 1 quart baggie feeders in the top. When I peeked in at them this morning they seemed to be starting to come and go like normal and there were a lot of bees feeding at the baggies. They were covering the comb, but there were also a lot of bees clusterd on the bottom of the queen excluder in the half where the frames were missing. How long do bees usually take to find a new home on their own? In other words, how much chance is there that they will take off again after spending the night in my hive?

4. There was a pretty good "traffic jam" at the entrance this morning. How long should I leave the entrance reduced to 1"?

[ June 23, 2006, 10:39 AM: Message edited by: Gene Weitzel ]

[iddee]

I would put the frames in imediately. There is always a chance they will leave, but since that chance can't be totally eliminated, I would just take the chance and install them. You do not want the mess they will make if you don't do it.

[Michael Bush]

>1. Given the circumstances, was there a better way to handle it?

Opening the top wasn't a good idea. Otherwise it's sounds pretty good.

>2. I had removed all but about 4 or 5 frames when I dropped the swarm in. I did not want to mess with them to put the rest of the frames back in for fear of them taking off again. How long should I wait before trying to re-insert the rest of the frames?

I'd be tempted to do it in about 48 hours or so. Until then I'd be afraid of scaring them off and even then they will probably have drawn some comb.

>3. I kept the hive closed up until about 10:00 pm, and then I gave them about a 1" opening and put two 1 quart baggie feeders in the top. When I peeked in at them this morning they seemed to be starting to come and go like normal and there were a lot of bees feeding at the baggies. They were covering the comb, but there were also a lot of bees clusterd on the bottom of the queen excluder in the half where the frames were missing. How long do bees usually take to find a new home on their own? In other words, how much chance is there that they will take off again after spending the night in my hive?

The longer they stay the more likely they will stay. If they stayed all night, that's a good start.


4. There was a pretty good "traffic jam" at the entrance this morning. How long should I leave the entrance reduced to 1"?

[Gene Weitzel]

>Opening the top wasn't a good idea. Otherwise it's sounds pretty good.

Are you talking about when I re-opened after they started to take off the first time I hived them? That time I did not open the top, only the entrance reducer and they came boiling out while the ones on the outside were trying to get back in. The second time I only left the outer cover off for a short time while the bees that missed the box when I dropped the swarm streamed into the hive since this was their only way in because I had the entrance completely closed.

>I'd be tempted to do it in about 48 hours or so. Until then I'd be afraid of scaring them off and even then they will probably have drawn some comb.

I was thinking maybe tomorrow morning when I inspect my other hives I would try to put the frames back in.

>4. There was a pretty good "traffic jam" at the entrance this morning. How long should I leave the entrance reduced to 1"?

Did you intend to respond to this one? If so it looks like it got cut off.

[Gene Weitzel]

Here is an update on this swarm:

On Saturday, I decided to try to replace the frames I had left out when I hived the swarm. I peered up through the SBB and there was a huge cluster of bees occupying almost the entire area where the frames were missing (the 5 frames that I left in were also completely covered with bees). I decided to add a second deep that was full of frames to try to lure some of this cluster up so I would not have to disturb them so much and then come back in 24 hrs to replace the missing frames. This seemed to work, on Sunday when I peered up through the SBB there was only a baseball sized cluster in the empty space. I lifted off the top deep and inserted the missing frames rather easily and was able to re-assemble the hive with a minimal amount of bees flying. They settled down quite quickly, however when I came back a little later to check on them they were a little more defensive than they had been before. Now some more questions:

1. They have been in the hive for four days and are now hauling in nectar and pollen. How long should I leave them alone before inspecting again?

2. This swarm was quite large (easily more than 6 lbs of bees) and I am hesitant to remove the second deep and try to consolidate them back down into one. How bad a mistake is it to let them keep the two full deeps right off the bat?

3. They have nearly consumed 1/2 gal of sugar syrup in the 4 days they have been in the hive. Although they are bringing in nectar and pollen now, our flows are slowing down and will end soon. Should I continue to feed them as long as they will take it?

4. Assuming that I captured the queen with the swarm, how long will it take her to start laying?

5. I now have the entrance opened up to about 4" and there is still a pretty good traffic jam. At what poiont should I remove the entrance reducer and let them have the full opening?

[ScadsOBees]

1. if they are hauling pollen and nectar, they should be settling nicely. The queen should be laying within a week, if a primary swarm, which if large is what I'd expect it to be. If you started them on drawn comb, I'd check in a week.

2. They will need 2 deeps eventually. They will use whatever space they need and can expand as necessary. If you need the extra box elsewhere, then you probably can consolidate after a week or two.

3. They will take it as long as you give it, so at some point I'd stop.

4. A week , unless she was in a secondary swarm.

5. If you are still feeding, I'd keep the entrance size down. Otherwise I don't think it matters much and open them right up.

-rick

[Gene Weitzel]

ScadsOBees:

Both deeps have about 4 or 5 frames of drawn comb, the rest are either starter strips or partially drawn frames. By this coming weekend they will have been hived for 9-10 days. Guess I can check for eggs/newly hatched larvae then (if I can get a strong enough pair of specs).

Currently I don't need the second deep so I think I will just leave it there.

Thanks for your advice.

[Michael Bush]

>>Opening the top wasn't a good idea. Otherwise it's sounds pretty good.

>Are you talking about when I re-opened after they started to take off the first time I hived them?

I'm just saying that I wouldn't disturb them while they are in the box. They might settle in. Disturbing them is more likelyt to convince them it's not a good home than vica versa.

>That time I did not open the top, only the entrance reducer and they came boiling out while the ones on the outside were trying to get back in.

Maybe I misunderstood.

> The second time I only left the outer cover off for a short time while the bees that missed the box when I dropped the swarm streamed into the hive since this was their only way in because I had the entrance completely closed.

I see.

>>4. There was a pretty good "traffic jam" at the entrance this morning. How long should I leave the entrance reduced to 1"?

>Did you intend to respond to this one? If so it looks like it got cut off.

I did mean too. I would leave it reduced for a while. It really won't hurt a swarm much for a couple of days while they get organized anyway as long as they can keep it cool.