From: "deelusbybeekeeper" <deelusbybeekeeper@excelonline.com>
Date: Thu, 1 Nov 2001 07:17:20 -0800
To: <BiologicalBeekeeping@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: What comes out of dark comb.

Hi all on Biobee
Micky originally wrote:
>> I would like to know what comes out of dark comb into honey.

Barry B. Wrote amongst others (including myself):
> I, like Micky, would like to know also. Two totally different replies above.
Is this another POV issue or can anyone point to data that supports either
one? Seems an important issue to deal with.

Reply:
Many excellent replies have been written, but now I am opening up my books since over the years we have sold wax for health food/medicinal usage along with our honey and propolis, and go over for others what has been officially said as basically as possible to my understanding.

Please referencefor this information the ABC and XYZ of Bee Culture, by A.I.
Root, 1983.

Starting page 187 left column: 'The brood cell cappings are made up of
shreds of cocoons, pollen, and almost anything that comes handy, with only
enough wax to wled the whole together. The beautiful whate color of
honeycomb becomes dark with age, and when used for brood rearing becomes nearly black.'

page 193 right column: Amount of wax in old combs: 'Many beekeepers who ship old combs to the wax rendering plant are disappointed in the amount of wax obtained. It is difficult to estimate in advance how much wax can be obtained from a given number of old combs. One report is given of 1240 standard frames of combs which were rendered, yielding 204 pounds of wax, or an average of 2.6 ounces of wax from each frame. This would be one pound and 10 ounces for a set of ten combs. Perhaps it is safe to say that from 1 1/2 pounds to as high as 2 1/2 pounds of wax can be obtained from a set of ten combs.'

Page 193 right column: Old Combs Darken Honey: 'Prof G. F. Townsend, Dept of Environmental Biology, Univ of Guelph, Guelph, Ontario, Canada has conducted trials on the darkening of honey through staining. He found that old dark brood combs definitely caused staining of the honey. It seems the darkening chemicals are water soluable and affect the honey (believe Peter went into this a little here) as long as the moisture content is greater than 21-22 percent. "Unripe" nectar, of course, may average as much as 60 percent water so the best way to avoid this staining is to use only light-colored combs for honey storage'

Now to add to this above from ABC & XYZ, we have talked here about small
cell comb helping to lower the moisture content of honey by increasing
envaporation made worse over the years by usage of bigger and bigger
enlarged combs, making the drying process for the bees to accomplish.

Now continuing: Page 198 left column: 'It is correct that honey stored in
old, dark combs maybe slightly darker than that stored in new, white combs.
Old combs are dark because they have become stained with pollen and
propolis. The same stains which make the wax in an old comb brown or black
may color honeoy when it is stored in them. (please see the moisture
comments above posted here) It is for this reason that some beekeepers have a supply of white combs, which are never used for brood rearing, but which are used exclusively for storing extracted honey year after year."

Now to go further: " When bees use combs for brood rearing, cocoons are left in the cells. The cocoons tend to give the combs additional strength.(now
the cocoons are also known to thicken the walls and decrease the inside
diameter of the cell wall- a compensation IMPOV here where necessary to aid
in colony survival!).This is part of the reason that old, dark combs will
almost never break in an extractor and will withstand rough usage. However,
white combs, which are never used for brood rearing, will become strong in
time as the bees add wax, and some propolis to weak points.'

Page 662 right column: "To those accustomed to think of teh product fo the
hive as natural and pure, it may be a shock to learn that beeswax is nearly
always polluted by resinous gums from propolis' From here the reader learns
of the origin of propolis by reading about writings from Francis Huber,
Quinby, T.W. Cowan, Langstroth, M. Perret Maisonneuve etc.

If you do not have the book ABC and XYZ of Bee Culture it is a book well
worth having!

Now resins and pollen from the blooms of plants have been used for various
dye colors for centuries besides preserving wood. Violins back hundreds of
years are shellacked with the resinous solution of propolis abtained from
bee colonies, as were many containers needing sealing to keep decay away.
(coffins,mummies, vessels for food, medicine, etc) The dyes made from pollen colors of plants where used for clothing, painting, staining, etc also.

The cocoons give strength, but technically the color comes from the pollen
and resins. As for the baby shit talked about, well the nurse bees clean
this and recycle this through their sytems and mouth parts, but the color
like all food passing though even humans is still dye from original sources
of resins and pollen. The cocoons add strength, the propolis the sterility
and anti fungal, anti bacteria, and anti viral gram positive and negative
for disease control and together all create a very ingenious system the
bees use to both raise brood and store food that has shaped much of our
lives and started the sciences of art, design/construction, math, science,
medical, navigation, etc and I could go on.

I will get off my soap box now, still saying I believe IMPOV the propolis
makes the combs dark, but now with the help of the pollen dyes. Strength is
another topic for the cocoons usage.

Regards,

Dee A. Lusby (still with Coggshall & Morse's book on Beeswax to read
through)