From: "deelusbybeekeeper" <deelusbybeekeeper@excelonline.com>
Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2001 08:42:39 -0800
To: <BiologicalBeekeeping@yahoogroups.com>
Subject: Re: 4.9 versus 5.0: data

Hi to all on Biological Beekeeping

Pav wrote the following:

> Hi Eric
>
> What size do you measure Lusby wax as, by what method? Large difference
to what we (Peter and i)
> got could indicate variable foundation (perhaps Dee produces different
batches at different
> temperatures - resulting in different amounts of shrinkage?), or seriously
undermine the
> accuracy/validity of all my measurements!

Reply:

Yes, Pav, when I mill there is a variable in the foundation sizing, just
like when it is assembly line embossed. Temperature is a hard problem to
control (outside temperature that is), that has to be compensated for in the
making process.

When it is cold in the winter time with temps in the 50s and 60s degrees F.,
my dipping pots average about 190 degrees F. When hot in the summer with
temps in the 100s my diping pots are normally set around 165-170 degrees F.

Also the degree temperature of the dipping water vats change with season for the temp of water coming out of the tap. In winter it is colder and in
summer time when it is warm I have been know to add blacks of ice to the
water to cool it down for successful dipping.

Also on the embossing rollers that I have that are metal tool and died in
the winter I have to manually heat the rollers prior to embossing to be able
to run wax through without cracking the foundation sheets I am embossing
from one end to the other.

The sheet of plain wax have to be warmed in the winter to mill (when I best
like to make foundation because is get the best shrinkage and specturm made below the 4.9mm absolute top sizing. In the summer I don't get so much shrinkage and have to rely upon the plastic sleeving to avoid fudge factor expansion by stretching during milling. (believe what I sent Barry which he measured on site was prior to winter coming on in fall when temps were
resonable still up and water had not cooled so much, so Barry measured
closer to 4.9mm). Right now what I am milling in our winter like I sent
Peter is to the smaller size I make.

So Pav there is indeed a range. That is why I say I mill 4.9mm and a little
smaller. just like when I said I used to mill 5.0mm - 5.1mm. Temperature
dictates a lot. But the bees also have a natural specturm of small, medium,
large for sizing also with thorax naturally to be matched, and this seems to
overlap nicely, if you learn how to overlay the two for field usage. Something not in books by the way. It's something you have to learn in the school of hard knocks of real world life and survival in field.

Already told Peter a while back for NZ, when asked about the size mills to
go for. Peter I said, and you can check with him Pav, since there is a fudge
factor for bigness, and 4.9mm is the top sizing by what we can tell for the
bees, Peter I said, go for 4.8mm mills for assembly line, because Reitche
makes mills 4.8, 5.0, 5.2. That way if you get fudge stretch you will not
go over the 4.9mm range top size and anything below in the 4.8 range is
good. Then I told Peter to sell to Australia and rest of the Far East
(Japan) and make money.

Regards to you Pav

Dee