From: "deelusbybeekeeper" <deelusbybeekeeper@excelonline.com>
Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 12:19:42 -0800
To: <BiologicalBeekeeping@egroups.com>
Subject: Re: cell size in supers

Hi to all on Biological Beekeeping

Helmut wrote the following:

> If larger drone also has the
> appropriate larger tool , then it might not fit the reduced size of the
> queen and therefore mating is not possible ???

Reply:
Helmut, I would not exactly say that mating is impossible, but highly
unlikely though, but for probably other reasons.While Drs. Nathan M Schiff
and Walter S. Sheppard have written in papers in the Journal of Economic
Entomology as far back as 1995 that the lack of A.m. mellifera haplotypes in
the commercial population is indicative of restricted gene flow between
feral and commmercial populations, I believe tht it is more appropriately
relative to size of the drones involved vs the size of the queens, as well
as overuse of artificial insemination technology.

It is known that the specific gravity of the bee changes with enlargement of
size by artificial mutation through use of bigger cell bases, however, this
is detrimental aerodynamically. To have the same amount of muscle covering a
larger area makes for less overall effectiveness of flight, which includes
speed. Also, as the bees enlarge with cell size artificially, the wings do
not enlarge proportionally, in relation to the size of the thorax, adjusted
by the width of the cell, creating thus workerbees, then thus enlarged
drones and subsequently the queens, that cannot carry pollen and honey at
the same time and thus necessatating more trips to the field. Also, the
slower speed that goes with being bigger, also makes for less trips being
able to be accomplished, on top of the fact that the poor bees now need to
make more, because they cannot carry so much. Now as the workerbees get
bigger, along with the drones and then the queens artificially, problems
arise.

Namely, enlarged domesticated drones have problems ketching faster flying
smaller natural sized queens, which makes for artificially restricted gene
flow. Also enlarged domesticated queens fly slower than the quicker feral
drones and are easily hit upon by them. In an area with few commercial
outfits, like in many of our western states, the feral then pulls apart the
domesticated strains quite easily. In an area with heavy commercial outfits
and good domestic sphere of influence and killing off of feral bees, this is
counterbalanced with the abundance of artificially enlarged drones, in ratio
to feral drones, and you don't see it so much, as in the north eastern part
of the US.

However, with the advent of parasites now and the larger artificial system
falling apart, as nature tries to correct its problem, this enlarged drone
dominance with spheres of influence, is quickly falling apart and the feral
survivers are now gaining more numbers.I don't think that many larger
beekeepers will have perpetual money to fight mother nature for the rest of
their lives. They will eventually be forced to change, to go back to what
works, or go broke.

Helmut also wrote:

> I wonder if one purchases a queen off the market with her genes adjusted
> to larger cell brood, will it not mess up what you are trying to
> accomplish ???

Reply:

It certainly will not make you work any easier, Helmut. Better to go into a
pattern of holding and expanding what you have,acclimatized to your own
area, than buy something that defeats your intended purpose and keeps your
problems going with mites and secondary diseases.

Reply:

> Any ideas what breeders are doing nowadays ???

Some are already starting to size down for the coming market and also not
wanting to perpetuate stocks that will not stand on their own. But like
anything else, the idea starts small for change and then gains speed as
problems arise.

Regards,

Dee A. Lusby
Tucson, Arizona
USA